First RR MT30 installed:

http://marinelog.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=3511:rolls-royce-installs-mt30-gas-turbine-in-new-uk-carrier&catid=1:latest-news&Itemid=195

Well apart from the fact (that you completely ignore or fail to understand) that every single F-35 made will have significant UK content.

No I am not saying that I am better then everybody else. I am saying that the general public do not have a clear enough picture of the complexities both positive and negative of European membership or the process of leaving to make a reasoned rational decision.

£50 million pounds a day is peanuts in the grand scheme of things in comparison to what we make from being in the common market. It is a fraction of what it costs to run the NHS in a day. I presume you like having the NHS? As a German Newspaper pointed out recently “The British want the good stuff without the bad”. Yes there is a cost of membership but the reward is the common trade we benefit from and harmonisation of regulations across the block. That reward is significantly more then we pay out.

So you know what these faceless beaurocrats spend the money on? A very emotional statement I have seen used so many times to justify any argument against the EU but usually not supported by any information outside of some lurid headline from the Daily Mail. Out of the three types of law in the UK only EU regulations are immediately enacted. Do you know what kind of regulations we are talking about? Whilst we always hear about the regulations imposed by faceless people on Brussels in respect of Banana size or sausage classification (actually both untrue) we don’t often get the reports about the good things like work place health and safety regulations. Harmonising those regulations is a very good idea. How about regulations on the dumping in chemicals in rivers? How about the ability to work and live anywhere in the European union, a right I have actually made use of.

Now don’t get me wrong there are many things that I feel should be reformed in particular the CAP and the madness of moving between Brussels and Strasbourg should stop but the idea of being on the outside watching as the EU make decisions without our input that would have massive consequences for agriculture, industry and the economy scares me. That people are happy to sleep walk into that needs to be raised. Are pro Europeans not allowed to point out the positives of membership? Don’t you think the public are not entitled to a rational informed debate rather then what we have now which is a storm of hate and anybody who puts a hand up and says “hang on” is branded an enemy of the will of the people!

Personally I do think we have a common heritage with Europe, myself I have recent French ancestry and I work for an international company working with people of all nationalities. The hostility you have shown me for pointing out that it is a complex issue, with many negatives of leaving that are often ignored and I would prefer to stay in saddens me j_jza80.

It isn’t so clear cut as to say the majority support your opinion, in a recent poll 47% said they wanted to pull out. That leaves a significant majority of pro and undecided people.

In the current economic climate of a triple dip recession I feel this whole Europe issue only serves to destabilise the country even more.

Well you would know about mistaking opinion for fact wouldn’t you snafu352…

I’m filled with despair! I am a pro EU membership British citizen! As far as I am concerned it would be a disaster and the general public do not realise the problems it entails!

Before somebody says “The British public should be allowed to decide”! That is all well and good but in my opinion the British public whipped up by a very EU-hostile press do not understand the complexities or what we would loose to make a reasoned rational decision!

It isn’t just a case of waving a wand sacking the MEP and stopping the money sent to Brussels! Many laws and infrastructure come from Europe we would have to negotiate a withdrawal and then set up alternatives for those laws and processes. We would then have to negotiate a new relationship with the EU and they would hold the high ground in that negotiation. It isn’t just a case of sweeping away Brussels bureaucracy there are many things that are done centrally with no equivalent in the UK but are things the general public would want! Also there are many employment laws that the Euroskeptics talk of sweeping away but the general public wouldn’t want to loose!

People keep on demanding a referendum not realising what that actually means and assuming it is a simple in out process.

djcross :

This is the kind of post we shouldn ‘t accept .
As an American , djcross thinks that an old F-16 with an old pod is the equivalent of the Eurocanards !
This is BS !
The F-teens are outdated , they can still do a good job but they are outdated . Just the idea to use a “pod” for EW/ECM is outdated (unless the pod is very recent and tailored for the ACTUAL threats) .
The EW systems onboard the Eurocanards are miles ahead of the US fighters ‘s systems . Even the F-22 has no ECMs !
I admit that updated F-15s have some good onboard gizmos but that ‘s about it .
Americans should be a bit more cautious and a bit more modest nowadays as their actual fleet of fighters is no longer the top of the range .
The F-35 is a massive disaster and even if it enters operational service in 2018-2020 , it will be a plague and most probably a hangar queen .
But nonetheless , we still have Americans lecturing Europeans on how to do things ! 😀 (not even talking about the B-737 “Dreamliner” lol)
It ‘s laughable …

Cheers .

You do realise that saying “an old F-16 with an old pod” is rather nonsensical in respect of that aircraft!

Do you mean an old F-16 like this?

Or an old F-16 like this?

Or an old F-16 like this?

Or an old F-16 like this?

Four F-16 certainly but they represent radical differences in electronics and systems! We have a vanilla Block 25, an MLU, a Sufa and a Block 60. The latter two electronics wise are little different and certainly not miles behind a Eurocanard. Actually in some areas they are ahead!

As for America lecturing Europe well to be fair they are very successful and shouldn’t be written off. Frankly you are exhibiting the worse kind of lunk-headed nationalism with little signs of understanding the nuances of the subject at hand!

F-35 is a massive disaster…really how much more so then other types? Many aircraft have had problems in development and it is only just entering limited service calling it a plague is a bit strong!

So if we all say you are flapping your mouth do you shut up?