Possibly, but you have to consider that the Flanker will be doing ~200kts coming out of that Cobra turn leaving him sitting for other enemy fighters in the area. The new AAMs let pilots keep their speed and energy high in dogfights while still being able to shoot across the circle.

That is one reason why the Navy went with JHMCS/AIM-9X instead of a TVC system on the Super Hornet.

And that is not the reason the USAF`s F-22 went for thrust vectoring like the Su-37 and that is not the reaon why the F-22 performs cobras

you are forgeting flying pairs of wingmen are tactics used by both sides and a pilot always will attack having not threat to his aircraft.

But they didn’t have similar numbers. The F-15s were at a 3-1 disadvantage.

A Cobra isn’t going to save an aircraft from of HOBS missile :rolleyes:

High off boresight missiles have not a 100% target kill probability, the only thing that the high off boresight missiles offers is less retrictions while flying and aiming the missile at the enemy.

Now the F-15s never flew in 1982 with inferiority in numbers that is a total lie, in 1982 Israel flew F-15s and F-16s but many people forget also flew F-4s and Kfirs and even had Mirage III in storage.
In 1982 both sides were more less matched in numbers because Israel also flew F-4s, Kfirs and A-4s

In 1991 the NATO forces had more aircraft than Iraq and they flew more F-15s and F-16, Mirage 2000s than Iraq MiG-29s.

in 1999 the NATO forces had more aircraft than Serbia specially considering Serbia only had 16 MiG-29s.
In the year 1993 if i am not wrong two Su-27s flew to the US and beat in the US another pair of F-15s in their own air base in mock combat

Not aware of the X-31 trials but the F-16MATV engagements where they simulated Fights with F-15’s and F-16’s (well over 100 sorties) they found it to be most effective when they were outnumbered 2:1 or more where the MATV could snap on and get a very quick kill !! They werent fond of going slow and this is echoed even by the raptor pilots who’d rather stay at speed and do most of the work because while they have the TVC advantage at low speed they loose out far far more by giving up the speed advantage !!

Bring_it_on

When is super maneouvrability useful?

Super maneouvrability is useful when you enemy has missiles with small angles off boresight engagement capability, an F-15 armed with AIM-9L can not fire a missile at any intended target beyond an off boresight angle of -35 or + 35 degrees, if the Su-35 performes a cobra turn and the F-15 over passes the Su-35, the AIM-9L seeker limitations will make impossible to aim the missile without pointing the F-15 nose at the Su-35 within an angle of +35 or -35 degrees since the F-15 can not point so easily its nose as the Su-35 can, the Su-35 cobra turn and the AA-11 archer seeker with an of boresight angle of +90 -90 in the best versions will give the total supremacy to the Su-35 over any F-15

That is the reason why high AoA are important and why disaccelerating is important.

Now if the enemy is an F-15 armed with AIM-9X, ASRAAM, IRIS-T or Python V, the F-15 pilot can aim its air to air missiles at full sphere of off boresight angles or in few words in a 360 degree off boresight range independently of the flight path direction the F-15 has.

In this case even the F-22 or Su-37 won`t be have any superiority in dogfight in a within eye ball range aerial combat using AAMs.

however once the F-15 depletes its arsenal of 4 AIM-9X or Python V the Su-35, Su-30MKI or MiG-29OVT will beat the F-15 in a gun dogfight any time

The F-22 more than any other fighter will be more likely to avoid been hit by the the AIM-9X or Python V thanks to supercruise, also its reduced radar and IR signature will make it a difficult target.
The F-22 is followed by the Eurofighter that is one of the most manoeuvrable fighters at supersonic speeds and has also super maneouvrability and super cruise.

oohhhh i thought yours favourite was MiG-23FF [frutty & fresh] 😀

what was the name of that manuver that tricks f-15s pulse-doppler radar and makes flanker dissappear from it.? 😉

Perhaps i like the MiG-29M more than the MiG-23, but the reason why i like the MiG-23 a lot is when i was a child and i saw for the first time a MiG-23ML picture i became eager to know more of that aircraft, my brother gave me as a present a Soviet magazine about the Soviet armed forces where they talked about the MiG-23, since then i always had fascination for the MiG-23, in the early 1980s the MiG-23 was a myterious aircraft, but to tell you the truth i feel the MiG-29M is the Russian aircraft i like the most.

I attached the first MiG-23 picture i saw in my life and since then i always wanted to know more about the plane, as an aeromodelist at the age of 11 i armed my first MiG-25 Foxbat

You get the point. Why do you not stick to that, but try to save a claim, which is outdated for years. The Russian will invest in newer AAMs like the others too.
The MiG-29 can do a Cobra, but I never heard that it was used in air combat. Not even in training at DSCTS.

To stay fair, except that, high agility is an advantage against an inferior equipped fighter. But it is still much cheaper to buy an AIM-9X, Phyton* or Iris-T f.e. than to bring up your pilots to the red-zone of a performance envelope.

Manoeuvrability is not a handicap, niether is unnecesary, the AIM-9X is definitively a real equalizer, F-15s armed with AIM-9X or IRIS-T are excellent fighters, but even with that the Cobra, the Chakra are not outdated as you say, simply they do not asure you overwhelming superiority.

The philosophy behind the F-22 is exactly that get the best of stealth, the best of agility, the best of missiles such as the AIM-9X, the best of supercruise and try to fuse them into an airframe with the least compromise possible.

A Su-35 still is a deadly opponent, the Chakra and Cobra turn still are useful up to a level but like any aircraft it has its limits.

If you are a MiG-31 pilot you will try to destroy the enemy with a R-37, if you are lucky and you can detect the F-22 you will try it.

If you are an F-22 pilot you will try to conceal your presence with stealth and kill your adversary with AIM-120s and if you are seen by the enemy`s radar well you will try to take advantage of supercruise and the AIM-9X.

If you are flying in a Su-35BM, you will try to kill your enemy either at long distance or using your super agility and your latest missiles such as the R-74 or the new K-30 if it enters service.

The F-22 is the most likely to achieve success and the less likely to be shot down.

The reality is Stealth is the best weapon the F-22 has

Mig, you wanna see some F-18 spins in mid air? This was done in the early 80’s!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nwYg13DAHq4&eurl=

Watch it! American’s know how to make maneuverable aircraft; all of our aircraft can do stuff Russians can, but they have to change the FBW. Please, stop living in denial, American’s have tested super-maneuverability, we just don’t normally show it off at airshows like Russians do all the time.

That is not the Helicopter that is a Flat spin, the helicopere is a controllable flat spin but it does not loose so much height and it is controlled by the Yaw thrust vectoring nozzle actuators

The Su-30 and Su-35 existed in 1991? In Dubai?

Like bring it on said, in a dogfight the Cobra turn has a limited envelope and can only be done with certain fuel loads at certain speeds.

Also, at 4:40 in the video, you get to see an expample of the yaw instability the Flanker design exhibits at high AoA, a trait that it not apparent with the Raptor.

I don’t really see anything in the video that the F-22 couldn’t do.

Reward firing missiles. :rolleyes:
You show me evidence of an actual separation test with those. Their effectiveness in real combat is very limited anyway.

The Cobra turn has been performed at combat weight and armed with 12 Air to air missiles by the Su-35 in 1994 at ILA 94 air show in Germany.

In Dubai 1993 (sorry it was Dubai 1993 not 1991) the Russians took a Su-35 and a Su-30 and they performed an air show mock combat demostration, the Su-35 performed the the Cobra turn and showed how it would use a Cobra turn in combat.

Pugachev himself performed the Cobra turn.

See the Su-35 had no thrust vectoring, now consider what is going to happen when the Su-35BM appears on the scene?

What is that all about?
The MiG-29 has its advantages in a manouver-fight against a F-16 below 325 kt, when the F-16 has its above that speed against the MiG-29 similar armed WVR.
When the F-22 and the possible MiG 1.44 are built to such kind of old style “knife-box-fights” it is a waste of money at all. The Cobra was no demand of the MiG-29 design. During testing the MiG-29s to its limits and behind, that manouvre was done and possible for test-pilots. It never had or has any relevance in any air-combat. Some people claimed that for marketing purposes to highlight the capabilities of that fighter, but it was never trained for real combat for obvious reasons. Both the MiG-29 and Su-27 are limited to ~ 30 AoA in daily operations and that is what is trained really.
The T-10 got a similar aerodynamic layout after a mayor rework. MiG and Sukhoi got that from TSAGI, before someone claim it was copied from MiG. But it is true it worked with the MiG-29 at first after some changes and Sukoi changed to that afterwards.
None of us can say what is better for stealth, when it comes to controlled flight. We have no idea even, what RCS level is termed by the Russians as stealth, when it comes to the frontal or overalll area?! For the F-22 we got small infos about that at least, thanks to the F-117 and F-35.

The Cobra has relevance, the Su-35 could simply apply that Cobra turn while turning not in the typical vertical Cobra but a horizontal Cobra.

Check the Su-35 without thrust vectoring