Hi Again,

As I see it the problem is this ;

In order to get elected the politicians court the support of two groups, the electorate and the establishment. This support is garnered largely in the following ways.

1. Letting the establishment continue as they always have, with a generally free had to ‘bend the law’ as they see fit. The politicians are of course rewarded for this (have a look at the registers of members interests – and remember a bribe is still a bribe even if you do tell to people about it). By always acting in an alliance of vested interests, these two groups set a poor example to the bulk of society.

2. With dwindling electoral turnouts they seek to engage the voters with ‘virtual bribes’ promises of better schools, talk of freedom and choice etc.
It is this latter post Thatcherite posturing that has done much to change people’s attitudes – to the point where individual liberty has become more important than social cohesion (witness the thread on bicycle helmets!), to the detriment of all, as the majority of this lands citizens imitate the self centred and egotistical behaviour of their ‘leaders.’

If we wish to avoid anarchy, and remember that true anarchy is the absolute removal of law, and thus absolute personnal freedom, we need to start to accept giving up some of our freedom and accept that in order to function a society must have the right to regulate itself; even if sometimes that means we can’t have or do what we want as individuals.

I’m willing. Are you?

Steve.

Grey Area is spot on with regards to human rights; personnally I have yet to meet a critic of human rights who has actually read the charter and all have shown their profound ignorance as to what it actually says.

These critics should of course read the charter and then decide which articles thaey would personnally be willing to give up. The right to life perhaps?

The real problem is in how do you police and enforce human rights. Most people rightly percieve them as something they are entitled to, but pay scant or no regard to the same fundemental rights of others. I personnally believe that the corner stone of law should be an obligation for all citizens to observe the human rights of their fellow citizens – because only when all prosecutions contain a human rights element will they truely start to pervade our collective conscience.

Steve.

Hi,

This is the one I was thinking of……

http://www.spitfireale.co.uk/spitfire_ale.htm

Steve

Hi,

Two mods I rather liked;

1. The Wellington modified as a test bed for the early jet engines. I’ve seen some film of it making a low pass with both props feathered solely on the Jet engine that was mounted in the tail.

2. I’ve also seen pictures of a Spitfire modified to carry a beer barrel!

Steve.

I’m with Bloodnok; HP42 Heracles would have to be no 1. Failing that a DH86 Express.

Wouldn aslo love any of the following Viscount, Brittania, VC10, BAC1-11 or best of all a Comet!

Steve

Hi, Don’t know about a book by Eric Brown just about Japanese aircraft, as far as I’m aware his books include:

Wings on my Sleeve.
Wings of the Luftwaffe
Wings of the Navy
Wings of the Wierd and Wonderful – Vol 1
Wings of the Wierd and Wonderful – Vol 2
Testing for Comabat

From memory he tests a Zero in one of the Wings of the Wierd and Wonderful books over Liverpool!

Streve

Just a thought.

Some years ago the Lakeside and Haverthwaite Railway repainted one of their Fairburn tank locos in full Caledonian Railway livery (ie pre grouping livery on a LMS engine!). Their argument was that they were preserving the memory of the Caledonian Railway and bringing a very eyecatching and
attractive livery to the publics attention.

Needless to say the purists were outraged, the public loved it, and I’ve been told that ticket sales soared.

Whilst I agree with Albert Ross that a puritanical approach to history is the only way to do a ‘total’ preservation job; we live in a world where this is a luxury. Therefore painting her in an eyecatching scheme that appeals to the general public would seem to be a reasonable thing to do and we can always argue like the L&H Railway that we are preserving the memory and colours of British Air Ferries or whoever for future generations.

Steve.