Tempest414I am not saying they did but what if some of the airframes whet through a refurbishment program in the last upgrades also if the FAA is not getting them until 2014 as part of the deal the Spanish may well do the refurbishment work
and we have all read that the FAA don’t want second hand fighters but someone may have grabbed the problem by the balls and told them that is what they are getting
Tempest414I would agree but a second hand western jet with outstanding upgrades available over nothing is the way to go if the Spanish F-1’s do have 6500 left working on 12 jets and 36 pilots each pilot flying 120 hrs per year would see each jet fly 300-400 hrs per year would give them 15+ years of service which is good amount of time to find a replacement post 2025
Tempest414If they do buy the Spanish F-1’s hopefully they will be the ones with A2A refuelling probes plus I would do a deal with France for the large centre line tanks
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Tempest414Sorry my Spanish is pants so is it saying they are looking at 12 mirage F-1M’s which have around 6500 hour left on them to enter service in 2014
Tempest414As I have said before Argentina lost the best chance they had in 82 by just extending the runway at Stanley to take the Mirage 3’s and Etendard’s it would have forced the British fleet to fight closer to the threat and they might of got a carrier
When you look at Argentina’s Military aviation all three services are flying too many different types and all do the same things like transport and Training they really need to make some simple changes that will save money and improve training and Tasking like
All basic flying training to be carried out at one school for all three services on one Type
Fast Jet Air force and Navy to train at the same school on Tucano and Pampa
All helicopter pilots to train at one school on the MD500 and bell 212 twin Huey
All multi-engine training to be carried out on the Twin Otters as they already have 10 of them
All fix wing transport to be carried out by the Air force with the exception of 5 C-212’s for the Army buy 8 C-295M’s for the air force and retire the F27 & F28 fleets
All transport helicopters to be operated by the Army 20 Huey 2’s and 15 Mil-17’s with the ramp plus two Helicopters for VIP work
All maritime patrol and SAR to be carried out by the Navy buy 18 Bell 412 for SAR role to be operated in 6 flights of 2 aircraft also add 4 C-295 MPA’s
Move all Learjet’s and Citations to the Air Force for VIP work
Find and order 2 two seat Skyhawks fitted to Fightinghawk speck transfer 10 Fightinghawks to the Navy to work along side Brazilian Navy Skyhawks on the Brazilian carrier
Buy the 18 Mirage F-1’s from Jordan upgrade them to MF2000 speck plus buy the 10 best F-1CR’s from for the recon strike role. I know they have tuned down F-1 in the past but I still think F-1 MF2000 is there best option at this time
So it would end up looking like this
Tri service Basic flying School operating 25 aircraft and shearing a base with the Tri service Helicopter training school operating 12 MD 500’s and 8 Bell 212’s for pilot and rear crew training
Tri service multi-engine training school operating 10 Twin Otters and the Airforce and Navy fast jet school operating form the same base operating 25 Tucano’s and 35 Pampa’s
The Airforce would operate
28 Mirage F-1’s
16 Fighting hawks
6 C130’s to be replaced by KC-390’s
8 C-295M
4 Learjets and 2 Citation’s
30 Pucara’s
Navy
12 Fightinghawks
4 P-3 Orion’s
4 C295 MPA’s
3 S-2 Tracker ‘s
6 super king airs
4 Seakings and 4 AS555’s
18 Bell 412’s for SAR
Army
5 C212’s
20 OV-1 Mohawks
20 Huey 2’s
15 Mil-17’s
20 Bell 206’s
20 Z-11’s
All other types would be withdrawn from service
Tempest414Argentina needs to do 4 things that will help there UN work and irretate the UK First buy 4 C295 MPA’s convert a second C-130 to a tanker Second buy 8 Knud Rasmassen Class OPV’s and 4 Absalon Class Frigates over the next 6 years Third buy 20 Mil-17s Forth buy 12 Mirage F-1 MF2000 in two batches over two years
using the MPA’s and OPV’s stop and search ships heading for the Falkland would give the UK problems also using a mix of fighters and MPA’s to force the Typhoons on QRA to fly 3 and 4 times a day would start to cost the UK
the 4 new frigates are ideal for UN work as they can carry upto 200 troop and some 55 vehicles and act as commard units
The 20 Mil-17’s would also be useful for UN work
Cost 4 Absalon Class Frigates 1.1 Billion dollars
8 Knud Rasmassen class OPV’s 800 milllion dollars
4 C-295 MPA 200 million dollars
18 Mirage F-1 100 million dollars from Jordan plus 15 million per unit for MF2000 upgrade
20 Mil-17 sorry please fill in but some where between 300 350 million dollars
C130 tanker convertion
Tempest414Right then lads its not that hard he has given you a population size which is Denmark which has 1.3 to 1.5 of the GDP to play with which is around 4.3 billion dollars per year
He has given you the threats
1) Too your East is a county that was at one time supported by the US as it has old F-15’s which means it will have other US hard wear however it doesn’t mean it is still backed by the US just a second strong country (i.e. Iran with F-14)
2) Said country is kick up over Islands that you hold so given that you have Islands to defend by air and sea you will need a BVR fighter capable of anti-shipping plus a MPA platform also given set info a AEWaC platform and A2A refuelling could be a good idea
3) To the West you have a country suffering from insurgents given this you need to police this boarder so you need some sort of recon and the ability to move troops anywhere they are needed East or West
You can always do with more info but there is enough to get on with
Tempest414Right then lads its not that hard he has given you a population size which is Denmark which has 1.3 to 1.5 of the GDP to play with which is around 4.3 billion dollars per year
He has given you the threats
1) Too your East is a county that was at one time supported by the US as it has old F-15’s which means it will have other US hard wear however it doesn’t mean it is still backed by the US just a second strong country (i.e. Iran with F-14)
2) Said country is kick up over Islands that you hold so given that you have Islands to defend by air and sea you will need a BVR fighter capable of anti-shipping plus a MPA platform also given set info a AEWaC platform and A2A refuelling could be a good idea
3) To the West you have a country suffering from insurgents given this you need to police this boarder so you need some sort of recon and the ability to move troops anywhere they are needed East or West
You can always do with more info but there is enough to get on with
Tempest414For a full defence and strike capability
Airforce
Upgrade the 36 Mirage F-1 to MF2000 to give me a multi-role BVR type in both A2A and anti-shipping also look to add storm shadow and Brimstone
15 Yak-130’s
20 A29’s as Trainers / COIN
6 C295 M
4 C295 MPA All C295’s will operate as 1 Squadron in 3 Flights
4 C295 AEWaC
2 757 MRTT’s
8 Denel Bateleur UAV’s
Army
5 Chinooks
15 Mil-17’s with the rear ramp
15 Lynx Wildcats with a 180 degree front mounted gun
Navy
10 Lynx Wildcats
6 Type 26 Frigates all fitted with Tomahawk missiles
10 Knud Rasmussen class offshore patrol vessel fitted with the same gun as the Type 26
4 Diesel submarines able carry 28 weapons to include Tomahawk missiles
Tempest414I feel that better place to start would have been to fit the MF2000 upgrade package that is being fitted to the Mirage F-1 based around the RDY-3 radar giving the FRS51 a BVR capability also they should think about removing one of the gun pods and fitting a laser designation pod in it place when A2G configuration
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what the Harrier cockpit could look like under MF2000
Tempest414TSR2’s performance was outstanding with one afterburner lit it could out run a Lightning with both lit Labour should have been struck off as a party for killing off TSR2. The Russians were in a flat spin over TSR2 and were shocked when the UK canned it
Tempest414EELighterning lets not kid our self’s that many in the RAF including a lot of high ranks were happy to see the FAA fix wing burn and even helped light the Fire as for Sharkey Ward a lot of what he says is on the money when you look past the ranting . As someone who worked for the Navy and is a currant reserve RAF officer this saddens me a lot. anyway that aside I to would have liked to see the FAA operate F-18’s I all ways felt that if there was a fault that ground the Typhoon fleet at lest the FAA could take on the UK QRA with little problems
Tempest414Sorry just check RAAF pay however the extra 10 operators at an average of A$75000 over 30 years come out at 22.5 million dollars still saving me 250 million dollars plus 10 more people have a job and are not taking doll money
Tempest414C-295 range is 2375 Nmi and with in-flight refuelling more the P-3 range is 2400Nmi about the same. As for crews C-295 operates a six man crew 60 crew x at an average of 32000 dollars over 20 years comes to 38.4 million dollars I am still saving 230 + million dollars but as Global Hawk has a 5 man operating crew using 15 operators in a 24 hr sortie with this in mind I am only paying for 10 extra operators not 60 so I am still way inside cash wise and have 10 more flexible platforms able to carry out roles such as SAR and maritime attack which global hawk can not yes global hawk can stay up for up to 30 hour but it can only do a third of the tasking
Tempest414Ok this time sticking to the rules
Fighters/Trainers
Primary Fighter 40 Mig-35’s
Secondary combat jet 50 JF-17 Block 11 with A2A refuelling
LIFT jet 25 Yak-130’s
COIN/ Trainer 30 A-29 Super Tucano
Transport
10 KC-390’s
4 TU-214’s converted into MRTT’s
10 An-32’s
2 An-148 VIP Transport
AEW/MPA/MULI INTEL
4 R-99A AEW&C
4 R-99B MULTI INTEL All working as on Squadron
6 P-99 MPA’s
Helicopters
6 Mil-26
20 Mil-17’s with the rear ramp
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