MildaveInteresting except from here about the F-35B STOL sorties generation rate.
The F-35B is well-suited to support of the Marine Air Ground Taskforce (MAGTF) in very austere locations,” says USAF chief of staff Gen Norton Schwartz, speaking at an event hosted by the Brookings Institution in Washington, D.C. “But the reality is, is that scenario is not a high sortie generation scenario.”
The USAF and the US Navy need greater sortie generation rates than the F-35B can provide, Schwartz says.
“What we think is needed is high sortie generation in order to provide persistence over the target and to engage the variety of targets that may exist,” he says. “Not in a confined battlespace, but more on a theatre basis.
MildaveLol how embarrassing would it be to tell the press that one of these expansive aircraft was lost at a FOB due to a lucky RPG…
MildaveThanks for the precision. I assumed the “big head” of the Herti was for satellite dish which the Watchkeeper seems to lack, making the Herti more suitable for long range ops, but with higher cost…
MildaveGermany lobbies hard for Eurofighter
With the Defence Ministry not being able to freeze the commercial contract to buy 126 Rafale fighter jets from French major Dassault Aviation, arch rival Germany is still lobbying hard to bring back Eurofighter typhoon in the competition.
In her bilateral meeting with Prime Minister Manmohan Singh on the sidelines of G20 summit at Los Cabos in Mexico, German chancellor Angela Merkel raised this issue and asked why Eurofighter Typhoon could not be considered for India´s biggest defence deal.
India intends to buy 126 combat jets at a price of $10.4 billion. After a two year long trial process Rafale and Eurofighter Typhoon were shortlisted. Subsequently, Rafale emerged as the lowest bidder.
With the Indian Air Force almost certain to place a follow on order of 63 more aircraft after the initial 126 planes, the deal value is all set to surpass the 20 billion mark and come as a major boost to struggling European economy.
However, the price negotiation committee in the Defence Ministry yet to complete the final contract, Eurofighter is not leaving any stone unturned to lobby at the highest level of the government to oust Rafale from the fray.
Eyebrows were raised recently when EADS was allowed to make a presentation in the front of the top brass of the government on Typhoon causing a ripple at the diplomatic circle. The Typhoon was designed by a consortium of three companies, EADS, Alenia Aeronautica and BAE Systems working through a holding company Eurofighter GmbH.
Sources said Prime Minister Singh made it absolutely clear to French president Francois Hollande that there was no question of reconsideration as Rafale was selected through a fair and transparent process. President Hollande thanked the Prime Minister for having faith on Rafale. However, there is still not any clarity on when the agreement would be signed though sources did not rule out the formal inking during the first India visit of the new French president.
MildaveManmohan, Hollande talk India’s $20-bn plane deal
Rio de Janeiro, June 20 — The just-concluded G20 summit in Los Cabos may have focused on the global economic crisis, but when French President Francois Hollande met Indian Prime Minister Manmohan Singh on its sidelines, their discussion also veered towards India’s $20-billion tender for 126 combat planes for which France’s Rafale is the lowest bidder.
Top Indian officials who accompanied Manmohan Singh to Los Cabos told IANS that the French president expressed “happiness” over India down-selecting French aviation major Dassault’s Rafale plane as the lowest bidder for the tender, described as the “mother of all defence deals” for its sheer size.
Hollande told Manmohan Singh that he was hopeful the cost negotiations for the Rafale that are in progress in India will conclude soon.
India named the Rafale as the lowest bidder in February.
Rafale had beat its closest competitor, European consortium EADS Cassidian’s Eurofighter Typhoon that is in service with the four partner-nations – Germany, Britain, Italy and Spain – and has been chosen by the Austrian and Saudi Arabian air forces.
If India signs the contract with Dassault, it will be Rafale’s first export order. Rafale is the frontline combat plane of the French air force as of now.
Though beaten in the commercial bids by Rafale, the Typhoon’s manufacturers are hopeful of returning to the reckoning and have voiced their keenness to quote a better price if India so desires. The Indian government, however, has not yet shown any interest in the overture.
Asked by IANS if the French president also talked about the EADS Cassidian’s efforts to get back in the race, an official noted: “No specific reference was made.”
Rafale, along with Typhoon, had in April 2011 edged out the Boeing F/A-18 and Lockheed Martin F-16, the Saab’ Gripen and United Aircraft Corporation’s MiG-35 in the Indian Air Force’s Medium Multi-Role Combat Aircraft (MMRCA) tender to emerge the front runners.
The Rafales, once the deal is signed and the delivery of the planes begins, will replace the aging Soviet-era MiG-21s of the IAF and will be the frontline plane of at least six or seven squadrons.
The Indian deal is also expected to bring business to the sagging fortunes of Dassault and revive the Rafale programme of the French air force.
IANS
MildaveIMO comparing the A400M with older aircraft on payload and range only is a bit unfair. It’s all about what were the requirements for the aircraft.
Then after the cold war the emphasis has been more on controlling cost over the life of the aircraft rather than pure performances. Finally it’s the first of its kind for many of the partners who took part in its development.
They wanted a medium lift with reduced cost, medium range, with other requirements depending on who’s buying.
In the end payload is the only real thing were it can be compared with the Belfast and even then we don’t know if the latter could have successfully carried the payload the A400M users intend to…
About cost, I think you’re both right. Cost have been reduced in many areas, complex areas like electronics, computers etc, but the cost of manhour, bureaucracy and procedures, safety regulations requirements etc have increased among other things. High cost in the defence sector is often due to countries delaying programs and often been unwilling to commit to the numbers originally ordered, defence companies increasing their margin as they know money is becoming scarce and they need to keep their shareholders happy, corruption etc. The privatisation of many companies doesn’t help on the long run because while they lower their prices at first to be competitive, they often manage to get some sort of monopoly (ask the UK with BAE) and then they are no longer concerned about lowering cost. Western companies seems to need a lot of managers as well… just saying lol. For one engineer you usually have 3 managers!
But with delocalisation and outsourcing, it’s undeniable that the cost of many thing hardware or software have decreased. The reliance on off the shelf components for many applications whether in the defence industry or space help reduce cost.
MildaveHerti looks more like a long range platform which might be more expansive to acquire. With the UK already using predator and France unlikely to go for it, I think watchkeeper is actually the best bet for the future.
MildaveLol at least that is what you like to tell yourself…
MildaveIMO, against insurgents drone with their persistence and reduced cost (at least in theory) are a far better solution. Should manned platform be needed for some reason then Super Tucano and the likes are the next best thing. While in theory operation a STOL aircraft in a FOB might sound nice, the headache that maintenance, logistic and supply chain would pose isn’t practical. Plus while the Harrier was a rustic and solid aircraft capable of operation from austere condition I doubt any body will risk operating the F-35 on such a scenario. I believe the support of the Marines and UK for that type of aircraft is political, while Italy and Spain doesn’t really have a choice due to cost. But now that they’re looking at the F-35B I’m sure they must wonder what it would have been like to go for a full carrier capability…
Against a modern opponent, the carrier capabilities will be used 10 times before the need of taking of a road ever come. If it does, then you’re likely losing big time… And beside the Gripen seems to be doing just fine taking of roads…
In the end, I think it’s a matter of culture and politics. The UK as the creator of the harrier wish to keep such a proud tradition, while the US marines want STOL more for political reasons than anything else.
Well at least that’s my thoughts. I currently see no justification for the development of STOL fighters given the current economical and political situation.
MildaveOr maybe because the Raptor will run away rather than engage in WVR where its advantages will be severely diminished…
MildaveBeside I doubt such a tactic would work nowadays…
MildaveWell I don’t think the Harrier thing was a conspiracy in itself, but I believe the all review was more than suspect in its goals, results and conclusions.
MildaveI expect any Rafale, Typhoon, Su-27’s derivative to do more than hold their own in dogfight against the F-22…
MildaveAnd on the side 😉
MildaveBut not everyone’s got the memo…
BAE Systems gets bigger role as hopes grow on £13bn deal
British defence giant BAE Systems is expected to play a more prominent role in potential renegotiations over the world’s biggest fighter-jet order.
BAE is part of the consortium that builds the Eurofighter Typhoon, which lost out to France’s Dassault Rafale in a bid to win a £12.9billion order from India for 126 jets.
Hopes that the European consortium might get a chance to submit a refreshed offer have risen with signs that the Indian Ministry of Defence is becoming bogged down in its talks with the French.
Until now, negotiations with India have been handled by the consortium’s German and Spanish arms of EADS and Italy’s Finmeccanica. But now it is expected that BAE Systems will play a more influential role.
India awarded Dassault the contract in January but it has yet to be signed; the Indian military are still examining the paperwork as well as the side offers over maintenance, training and upgrades that the French made to win the contract.
Normally negotiations move towards a conclusion more quickly, and the delays are being interpreted as India having second thoughts.
The Eurofighter consortium also believe that there is considerable disquiet in the Indian establishment about the decision to go with the French fighter.
Recently, Dassault has initially won important contracts for the Rafale in competitions in Brazil and the United Arab Emirates, but has subsequently been unable to clinch the deals.
In case the Indians change their minds, the Eurofighter team has finalised a new bid, which is expected to cut the £120million-plus price of the Typhoon by £3.5million.
BAE Systems said: ‘We fully respect the process adopted by the Indian government and we and our partners have made it clear that, should we be invited, we stand ready to engage.
‘Ahead of any opportunity to re-engage or clarify the offer, it would seem sensible for us to review the bid to ensure that it is as competitive and compelling as possible.’
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