It has ? I though the AASM’s integration had been cancelled, not only for lack of funds, but also for aerodynamic reasons (I read this some years ago in an Air & Cosmos)… :confused:
I am not 100% sure, but I think what’s missing is full separation tests, from all 6 pylons and from different speeds/altitudes. So what I meant was that the Mirage 2000 can definitely carry and launch the AASM, but it’s not fully integrated and so can only be launched with restrictions. I don’t think testing would be hard, but it would probably be expensive given the AASM’s high degree of instability.
But as far as I know, the French fired MICA IR, so the claim seems valid.(radar guided aam shot)
No, the press release says it was a MICA RF.
Found on EF’s site a report (http://www.eurofighter.com/news/20090104_AMRAAMFiring.asp), which states that a pair of EFs did a data linked launch and that this is the 1st KNOWN LAUNCH of that kind?!
…I was under the impression that Americans already did it with F22:confused:…and I’m not sure that EF’s officials would make a April Fool’s jokes on their business site (check the date)…
The Eurofighter claim is quite misleading. They must be referring only to AMRAAM, because surely they know that their EADS pals at MBDA and Dassault did a similar, very well-publicized, data-linked firing with a Rafale/MICA combo two years ago???
The pilots or crew is part of the empty equipped.
Empty equipped does mean a fighter ready to go without payload.
Payload is all fuel outside the lubricants and weaponsload including the related pods, what does give the mission range. By the way, the reason, why George gave the TOW and related fuel weight only.
I agree with your definition of empty equipped (i.e. “operating empty”). However my point is that other fighters’ published empty weights are generally NOT empty equipped. For example, the F/A-18C weighs about 23,800-24,700lbs empty (10,800-11,200kg), but its “operating empty” weight is 28,000 lbs (12,700kg) once you include pylons, pilot, expendables, lubricant etc. Similarly, the Typhoon’s 11,000kg or the Gripen NG’s ~7,000 kg empty weights are not “empty equipped”. That’s why for an apples-to-apples comparison I’m subtracting the pilot and pylon weights to get to 10,150kg empty for the Rafale B (this is the upper limit, since still need to subtract lubricants etc).
The author did not write two 3,540 lb capacity drop tanks [each], but
“With 9,350 lb of fuel in the internal tanks [wich is the total intern] and two 3,450 lb capacity drop tanks on the inner wing stations.”
Are the 3,450 lb the total extern of both tanks similar the 9,350 lb of all internal tanks or did he miss to write 3,450 lb each?
The weight of the empty tanks and related pylons was added for the subtraction.Clarification is welcome about that.
From a grammatical perspective, “Two 3,450 lb capacity drop tanks” means that each drop tank has a 3,450 lb capacity. In English, the “each” is implied.
This also matches expectations, since 3,450lb = 2,000L, and we know that the Rafale regularly carriers 2x 2,000L drop tanks. It can’t be the 1,250L drop tank, because 1,250L = 2,200lbs.
The Mirage 2000 can also carry up to six AASM, in both GPS/GPS+IR, and 250/125kg versions. The loadout is 2x on the center pylon and 1x on each of the fuselage pylons. The AASM isn’t in squadron service on the Mirage 2000D (may never be due to funding issues), but has been qualified on a Mirage 2000N testbed.
6x AASM 250 GPS and 4x (or 6x?) AASM 250 GPS+IR:

1x (or 2x?) AASM 125 GPS
well it might have resulted in an Anglo-French EFA (not too sure about German, Spanish and Iti involvement maybe they would be involved but i’d wager they would buy SHs instead.)
but multinational consortiums with the French never went too well (theres no way to word that well)
Actually, the French have had many successful multi-national consortiums (Transall, Alphajet, Horizon, FREMM, Helios, not to mention all the Airbus and Eurocopter aircraft, including NH90).
For whatever reason, it’s only on the minority of projects where both the French and the Brits are both onboard that problems arise: Jaguar, CVF, Eurofighter, Horizon… The only exception is for missiles (PAAMS, Storm Shadow). Who’s to say the French are to blame? :diablo:
The intresting info is, that the Rafale B is over 12 tons empty equipped. 😎
Looks like some shoddy math…
40,300lbs take-off weight – 9,350lbs internal fuel – 2x 3,540lbs external fuel
= 23,870 lbs or ~10,830kg.
– 2x 100 kg pilots (with gear)
– 2x 240kg external fuel tanks (with pylons)
= 10,150kg
This is the apples-to-apples number that should be used to compare to other aircraft such as the F/A-18, Mig-29, Gripen & Typhoon. The published numbers for other aircraft generally also don’t include pilot, chaff, ammo, pylons etc…
No. The French Army is losing all its Roland & Hawk systems, which won’t be replaced. However, it is gaining the Air Force’s short range Mistrals. A total of about 200 Mistral launchers will be split between the 10 combat brigades artillery regiments, with 18 launchers for most brigades and 24 launchers for a few of the larger ones.
The French Air Force will take over the Hawk’s long-range air defense role. The 10 SAMP/T batteries (i.e. 40 launchers) will be spread across the 5 most strategic airbases: Luxeuil, Istres, Mont de Marsan, Avord & St. Dizier (all bases for nuclear-capable squadrons, AWACS & refuellers). 4 of these 10 batteries (so 16 launchers) will be permanently available for use by the French Army or expeditionary missions.
Unfortunately, the older Crotale 3000 EVA systems that currently protect most French Air Bases will also be withdrawn without replacement by 2012, since they are at the end of their service lives. It’s unclear whether the 12 Crotale NG launchers, which are much newer and are split into 3 batteries at Avord, St Dizier & Istres, will be retained, redeployed to new bases or withdrawn from service.
enrr is correct. The French recently reduced their order from 12 batteries down to 10, and from 575 missiles down to 375. 2 batteries were delivered in 2008, with 3 more to be delivered this year.
Each battery has 4 launchers, so a total of 32 missiles.
One of the main things I don’t understand about the concept is the nuclear propulsion. For ASW or convoy escort missions in the Mediterranean or North Atlantic it would have been completely unnecessary. For amphib operations, she would have most likely deployed with non-nuclear LPDs and other non-nuclear ships. Contrary to a CTOL carrier, high speed endurance was not needed for helicopter operations or deployment to crisis spots.
Beautiful ship, but I’m glad she was never built.
The concept was very flawed: the equipment fit was very high end and therefore very expensive (C3, weapons, propulsion etc). Yet the added value she would have brought to the French fleet was very limited. Her missions were only ASW and helicopter assault, both of which could be done well enough by Jeanne D’Arc at a fraction of the cost (+ dedicated frigates & LPDs).
For that price, fixed wing aircraft would have been a must. She was also too small, so she wouldn’t have offered good value for money, given how cheap steel is. Finally, she looked a lot like a carrier, so if she’d been built she might have threatened funding for CdG.
No not propeller problems – propulsion problems. Something to do with the connectors between the steam turbines & gearboxes – there are 4 connectors, 2 per shaft, and the vibrations are affecting one connector on each shaft, meaning that she still has 50% power on each shaft.
One possible cause that’s been suggested is a misalignment or cracks of some sort. Some of the replacement parts that were added during the refit were modified slightly, so maybe they’re not working as well as the original parts.
I only have paint, not photoshop. It is somewhat limiting, but if you choose the pic carefully you can still manage quite a lot. I’m still on my first computer, a laptop I bought four years ago and the hard drive is getting a bit full (only about 5 Gb left) so I’m waiting until I can afford a new computer before I start adding fancy programs like photoshop!:D
One word: Paint.NET. You can find it here: http://www.paint.net
Ever since I switched from Paint, it’s been a lifesaver. I have a similarly old computer, and Paint.NET runs very snappily, with many great features such as rotate, layering, autoselect, autofill etc. 😎
Here are some more detailed Buccaneer drawings if you want to draw it to scale:
http://www.hunterteam.com/buccaneer_tech_specs.htm
This image in particular would make a good starting point:
Here’s another drawing of Victorious:
The same website has some great detailed drawings of Victorious:
http://www.wunderwaffe.narod.ru/WeaponBook/Victories/Draw/index.htm
Hi Obi Wan
Thanks a lot for those. Now if only I had a paint package to hand to do what I want with all of those.
You should use Paint.net. http://www.getpaint.net It’s free and allows for layering & easy colouring, which is great when you want to modify drawings. I used it to draw up a comparison of several carriers to scale, using stock drawings I found online:
From this thread:http://forum.keypublishing.co.uk/showthread.php?t=86729