The language is Polish. So, use: http://www.systran.co.uk/ (online translation > select languages, provide url and presto!)
Desert vipers from a Ukrainian shipyard
Marcin Schiele
Russian shipyards and Ukrainian they have the multi-yearly connected experiences with planned works, by construction and by modernization of river ships of combat different classes and size. From beginning XX in. originated into them several hundreds of such individuals – among them monitors, gunboats, artillery kutry armored, kutry dozorowe, the mine-layers of faces, minesweepers and other. Adapted it to the operation combat in the large Russian rivers, channels inland, large jeziorach and on płytkowodnych of sea areas, how for example. Finnish gulf – akwenie sown thousand small islands and stones. All these ships favourably passed examination in the real of combat conditions, podczas and in. św., civil war, local conflicts on distant east and in period II in. św. Thanks to the dense and strong construction and many-sided armament were the unusually efficient during the operation supports of own ground forces, particularly on the principal directions of attack, how for example. during of the Manchurian operation of in August 1945.
The rich traditions
In post-war period on the territory of Ukraine built it is many of river ships in two shipyards – inland in Mikołajowie and to coastal in Kerczu. On 1967 both shipyards carried out several series relying connecting elements of 120 kutrów armored of project 1204 Szmiel, in arms originally in one 76- mm the short tank gun, arranged in the tower of the vehicle swimming PT-76 and into two 14.5-mm najcięższe k.m., situated within a one-man tower 2M6 (some later kutry these dozbrojono, among others in one 17-tubular launcher 8U36 for the 140- mm of stabilized rotary missiles M14OF; in this version of individual are marked as project 1204M). All Trzmiele (szmiel this in Russian bumble-bee) created the vertebra of terminal forces KGB in years of 1970. and 1980. , serving on the Danube, Amu-Darii, Amurze, Ussuri and other rivers. The presently small number of these kutrów is found in the equipment of Russian and Ukrainian flotillas of terminal guard. The fall OF THE USSR and solution UW at the beginning years of 1990. caused the break of all serious works of conceptional relative modern ships river, led through the sea offices planned in Petersburgu and in other centers of ship’s powstałej at the same time of Russian federations.
On the proclamation of independence through Ukraine, all ancient Soviet shipyards and company of defensive industry became perturbed through the new government in Kiev, obtaining full independence from a former head office in Moscow. The largest research-planned center is found in the city Mykołajiw (dew. Nikołajew, pol. Mikołajów), situated in the bottom run of river Boh (dew. Jużnyj the Bug), just before the withdrawal to Black Sea. Presently known it am under anglojęzycznym the shortening SRDSC (State Research and Design Shipbuilding Center) and work on the advantage many shipyard finding itself among others in Mikołajowie, Kiev, Oczakowie, Sewastopolu, Teodozji and Kerczu. From 1992 SRDSC prepared many plans of ultramodern of combat ships, such how destroyers, the frigate, korwety, dozorowce VILLAGES, the individuals of frontier armies and the like. The majorities of these projects did not imitate to be materialized considering chronic lack of necessary funduszów to the refreshing of the state MW of Ukraine. Built the only relatively high figure of very small individuals for national and foreign services of protection of sea-coast.
From among the projects SRDSC is found also the combat, river ships representing different sizes, philosophy of construction and the degree of the promotion of new technology. It is several projects of such presented individuals on targach of defensive industry, for the first time into 1997 in Kielcach, during a sixth edition MSPO. At the same time mikołajowskie center introduced two projects płytkowodnych kutrów, the first modernized, but second completely new.
Searches
The first project, the signified as cayman of 50, was the upgraded variant of the individual of project 1204M, driven through two new compression-ignition engines, in arms in 2 towers from the armored BWP – on the beak from the vehicle BMP-3, but on the stern with BMP-2.
The second project, called Giurza (desert viper), is necessary to a new generation and is endowed in the elements of modern technology stealth. Its principal armament creates also land towers, that is to say with BMP-2 on the beak and from the transporter BTR-70/80 on the stern.
According to public declarations SRDSC, the largest interest of a relative potential purchase of both projects expressed the government of Uzbekistan, which pragnął to fasten protection of State borders. At first uzbeckie MO predicted purchase first of all until 10-15 kutrów 55-tonowego project cayman of 50, for the purpose of the strengthener of the forces river operating on Amu-Darii and Syr-Darii, but also on the inland Aral sea. Lack of sufficient of the budgetary middle of this ministry caused the significant shift of the time frames marking the realization of this ambitious program.
American help
Only on the events from 11 September 2001 polityczno-military situation was changed radically. Uzbekistan became the serious member of the coalition of anti-terrorist in the region Central Asia. Government in Taszkiencie obtained from THE USA in years 2001-2002 financial support carrying out 215 million USD. The certain part of this spent sum on the purchase of modern individuals of river, in this case two armored kutrów artillery of the project Giurza, which had to be appropriated to, of uzbecko- Afghan protection border running in the certain part on the section of river Amu-Daria.
Contract between the government of Uzbekistan but the shipyard OAO Zawod Leninskaja Kuznica from Kiev became signer of 29 June 2003. Keel under the prototype cruiser situated officially of 19 February 2004 in covered of structural room. During the ceremony wodowania, przeprowadzonej 2 October 2004, the prototype became christened as Dżajchun (is this ancient name Amu-Darii). Soon this small warship carried on the one-month-old river shipbuilding tests, przeprowadzone on the artificial reservoir Kaniwśke Wodoimyszcze in the river Dniepr, below Kiev. Towards the end of October he became sent on board the aircraft transport An-124 Rusłan to Uzbekistan.
The identical legal procedure of construction, tests and transport passed several days later also the second cruiser, Sajchun (ancient name Syr-Darii). Towards the end of the November 2004 both individuals became finally complex, doposażone, przetestowane and introduced to the service of the flotillas of river Uzbeckiej guard of borderland, eligibly with side numbers of 01 and 02. Presently both desert vipers operate on Amu-Darii on the basis of the base portu of river Termez, serving to the counteraction of a illegal migration, control przemytu and przerzutu narcotics and other of policyjno- anti-terrorist jobs.
The roots
Idea kutra Giurza worked out engineer. Siergiej Kriwko, the principal designer of program. This płytkowodna individual has the exceptionally modern outer architecture, utilizing the elements of technology stealth in the shape of a strong inclination of the walls of superstructure and both burt – in transverse section figure kadłuba has the shape of a flattened hexagon. Such solution give the essential decrease echa of radar, but also the visibility of individual. Thermal background decreases the location of wylotów spalin from of principal engine room – below of water line. All fuselage shared on 6 of waterproof sections (from dziobu): forepeak with the warehouse of anchor chain, habitable space for 4 sailors, combat section with the warehouse of ammunition, section with the cabins of the commander and of non-commissioned officer, the section of engine room and achterpik with the warehouse of ammunition and steering machines.
Within the superstructure, about the shape of a truncate pyramid about of octagonal base, is found the extensive endowed pilot boat in 13 of panoramic windows, exercised with szkła armored and all indispensable instruments of navigation and unity. Construction kutra exercised became with several basic materials, in this:
of ship’s steel on the deck, bottom, pawęży, grodziach and partly to both burtach,
many-layered, kompozytowego pancerza steel-aluminium, by which coated all walls of superstructure and burty on the height of combat section and machine (he protect only before 7.62 x 54R mm by missiles ppanc. BT),
of armored steel on both towers armament,
light stopu aluminium, from which carried out oblique mast and the small elements of on-board equipment.
The construction
Cruiser Giurza characterizes the high degree of automatism of basic of truncated systems. Among them to mention is necessary system monitorujący the state fences waterproof and the presence of water zaburtowej in each section, the autonomous fire-fighting system and the net of internal television (CCTV). Important role fulfils also, system filtro-wentylacyjny enabling operation in of contaminated zones defends chemical. Within a rostral half kadłuba is found altogether 6 koi for a all crew, including in this separate kajutę for the commander. Conditions the habitable crews they are very good, but this thanks to the application of a yearlong of air-conditioning system, small pentry with the cooker mikrofalową and by refrigerator, bath-room with warm water and WC fulfiling all obligatory at the moment standards ecological.
Cruiser river is driven two high-speed sea compression-ignition engines of a Ukrainian model 459K (is this zmarynizowana version of tank engines of type 6TD, applied on the vehicles T-80UD)” and they develop strength of 735 kW each. Are they joint with two wałami and two screws about the fixed skoku, working within so-called. półtuneli, localized under the stern part bottoms. With wylocie these tuneli, just before pawężą, situated two surfaces steering. Thanks to such configuration any element of driving system do not protrude below the surfaces of bottom, that permits to individual on the shipping on very shallow of inland water. Both engines 459K (6TDK) are remotely controlled immediately with sterówki.
Cruiser achieves fixed maximum speed of 28 in (52 km/h), but its temporary speed possible even to estimate to 30 in (55 km/h) on quiet water. In the internal of fuel containers is transported maximum about. 5 000 kg diesel fual, which enables the operation on the distance to 540 mm (l of 000 km) with speed of economic of 11 in (20 km/h). Autonomiczność kutra with the normal of displacements carries out 5 days – parameter this possible to increase to 7 days on the foregoing enlistment of a additional quantity of fuel, water, eatables and so on.
In machine section is found the small, internal-combustion generator about strength 17.4 kW producing energy electric indispensable to the reinforcement of all of truncated systems. In the event of the damage of generator, the systems these they can take back energy from a reserve battery of storage batteries, during to 4 hours.
The teeth
Both desert vipers have typical – for all Russian of river individuals – system of armament, comprehensive the standard uncovered towers immediately with BWP worked out in years 1970/80. Such solution give to these kutrom full kompatybilność with land detachments, above all from the point of view the supply in ammunition, exchangeable part and of repair service. On rostral deck stands some przemodelowana tower with BMP-2, endowed in three standard models weapon. She have only one crew member – działonowego – and additional space for the individual of fire in the place of a superseded fotela commander. The principal weapon this automatic gun Tułamaszzawod 2A42 kalibru of 30 mm (L of 95), stabilized in two surfaces and powered two-sided through two types of ammunition – ppanc. BT and odłamkowo-burzącą OF. The maximum efficient sonorousness of the level of both types of missiles carries out 2 000 and 4 000 m (theoretical ballistic sonorousness this 10.3 km). Gun 2A42 can also lead fire against the different air subsonic targets, thanks to the large angular of raising barrel – to 74o, and the high of rates of fire – to 550 poc. /faces. The effective zone the blows of air targets have shape rombu about the base of 2 500 m and the heights of 2 000 m.
Targets such land, how lightly/averagely armored vehicles, is destroyed through the missiles BT, which przebijają the perpendicular steel homogeneous cuirass about thickness 42 or 28 mm, from the distance – eligibly – 500 or l 500 m. Only still worked out in of ancient time Czechosłowacji, wolframowy subcaliber missile Jh/8Wc can of penetrations such cuirass about the thickness until 78 mm from the distance of the half of kilometer, with of the escape speed l of 300 m/s.
The second basic weapon of tower BMP 2 is rejected from jednoprowadnicowej the launcher 9P135M of installed on its roof. This 120- mm steered missile ppanc. Tuła 9M111 bassoon, appropriated to the destruction of strongly armored vehicles – principally tanks, or strengthenings żelbetowych. Its accumulative head penetrates steel plates about thickness of 400 mm, on the distance to 2 500 m.
The third system of armament creates the paired tank machine rifle – assembled on the left side of barrel 2A42 – a standard model PKTM kal. 7.62 mm (L of 105). Within this driven electrically tower and in the section podwieżowym is found the adequate individual of fire – 600 cartridges scalonych kal. 30 mm, 4 thousand. cartridges kal. 7.62 mm and that at least four steered missiles ppanc.
On stern deck, tuż with pawęży, secreted place for a small tower, which normally is installed on of wheeled transporters BTR-70. This single-seat, electrically directed platform of weapons is endowed in two typical rifles machine: najcięższy Władymirow KPWT kalibru 14.5 mm (L 93) and tank Kałasznikow PKTM kal. 7.62 mm (L of 105). Both models of weapons are completely sufficient to the control of slowly flying of air targets on the low ceiling (for example. light unmanned of reconaissance middle) and lightly or nieopancerzonych the targets of such land, how position of field artillery, armored transporters, all-terrain vehicles and the like. Within the tower BTR of 70 and in stern warehouse is found the regular individual of fire relying l of 000 cartridges scalonych kalibru 14.5 mm and 4 000 cartridges kal. 7.62 mm.
Each crew member is usually in arms in the light personal weapon, principally in the carbines automatic Kałasznikowa RPK-74, AK-74 or ACRE-74, all kalibru of 5.45 mm. On both individuals it is possible moreover very easily also to zaokrętować other models of the weapons of infantry, for example. howitzer ppanc. RPG-7, steered missile plot. Strieła 2 needle, automatic howitzer AGS of 17 and the like.
Eyes
The cruiser of project Giurza has the very modern system of the equipment of combat electronics, appropriated to the detection of armored vehicles, air and of river individuals, to guidance the principal systems of on-board armament and to the jobs of electronic counteraction. The passive system WRE creates several launcher of smoke grenades and of laser detectors. On the roof of the superstructure of arranged four fogs the 82- mm of short mortar 902W Tucza, broadly applied on all land vehicles combat of Russian productions. Grenades they can be rejected on distance 200 or 300 m, creating the not transparent smoke curtain before the beak kutra. The front of this curtain has length of 80 m and height that at least 5 m, during 10 s from the moment of firing.
Signal to the activation of system WRE descends from four, of laser detectors radiance located about sterówki tuż higher up the level of windows. On the roof superstructure installed the modern head elektrooptyczną, endowed in the typical today sensors, in this daily chamber TV, infra-red chamber and laser range-finder. This wielosensorowa platform, signified as owl and prepared through the office SDC Arsienał from Kiev, serves to a twenty-four-hour supervision of space about kutra and to the support of principal systems of weapons. Built-in microprocessor in the head fulfils the role of the mini- system of establishment for of the tactical needs of commander.
Shipping on the surface of river ułatwia it is several modern of navigational instruments. Below topu inclinational masztu, on the narrow platform, is found the light navigational radar with crevice antenna, supplied through the Japanese Furuno. Its indication they are correlated and likened with the co-ordinate topographic, which takes back, of a satellite antenna system DGPS (Dynamic Global Positioning system) also set up on this maszcie. Within the room sterówki located the indices of two of indispensable instruments for each steersman – żyrokompasu and of perpendicular sonic finder. The crew of individual has also to disposal the rich system of the equipment of outer unity, which they are entirely peaceable with the analogous equipment of own detachments ground forces. System this encompasses four typical endowed radio-stations in the long bar antennas, working in the strands HF (3 – 30 MHz) and UHF (300 – 3 000 MHz). They serve to a fixed, two-sided communication with the land operating center or with the military tactical groups of differential levels – by companies, by battalions, by pułkami and the like.
The avant-garde
Dżajchun and Sajchun they are presently most modern, high-efficiency river armored kutrami combat in the world and they determine the very important element of protection of a south border of Uzbekistan. Their system of electronics, armament and to unity enables the effective leadership operation of patrol by day and nocturnally, in the differential of weather conditions, and gives full kompatybilność logistic with the national land detachments. The extremely progressive outer shape kadłuba and superstructure decreases probability of detection through the enemy optical sensors, elektrooptyczne and radar, and penetrations through the missiles from of machine rifles – this last feature strengthen the unusually rational schema of the distribution of the materials of ballistic protection. Thanks to the very small dip – only 90 cm – desert vipers they can immediately to moor with the bank of the river where can be very easily disguised with use many ready to hand materials, such how gałęzie trees, list, reed and the like. The land towers with armament and the certain compression-ignition engines permit on the cheap exploitation during a all cyklu life.
By one from easily observable mistakes of this constructional individuals is for sure too small height of the line of fire of both principal barrels kalibru of 30 and 14.5 mm, that can cause the damage – through the own missiles – of on-board equipment on the rostral and stern part kadłuba.
From the point of view a Ukrainian of shipbuilding industry and defensive, kutry project Giurza they are very attractive offer commercial in the international market sea, above all for not very rich countries and the users of obsolete gunboats of project Szmiel (exactly Uzbekistan had until quite recently three such individuals in the active service). The however new project is adapted to the installation of principally typical Russian pojazdowych of artillery towers and therefore can be zamawiany above all through these forces sea and terminal guards, which they have – or will have in the forseeable future – stabile and very good relationships with the deliverers of such platforms of armament, that is to say in practice only with Russian and Ukrainian company of defensive industry and State head offices trade special products…
Basic datas of technical armored kutrów artillery of project Giurza
Standard displacement 30 000 kg
Normal displacement
34 000 kg
Full displacement
38 000 kg
Entire length
20.70 m
Length on KLW 19.30 m
Entire latitude 4.85 m
Dip with wyp. std 0.84 m
Dip with wyp. full 0.88 m
Height (to topu masztu) 6.02 m
Principal engine room 2 diesel engines 6-are cylindric with 12 tłokami 459K about joint strength of 1470 kW
Auxiliary engine room compression-ignition generator about strength 17.4 kW
Speed maks. temporary 30 in (55 km/h)
Speed maks. fixed 28 in (52 km/h)
Economic speed 11 in (20 km/h)
The range of the natation 216 mm with 28 in (400 km with 52 km/h)
400 mm with 11 in (740 km with 20 km/h)
Autonomiczność 5-7dni
Diesel fual (normal reserve fund) 4 000kg
The cuirass 33 – 7 mm armored steel (on both towers) 10 – 5 mm kompozyt steel-aluminium (superstructure and partly burty)
The crew one officer and 5 sailor
Source: Own working out on the base of materials SRDSC
pic 1: The figure of a river kutra artillery project Giurza according to the state just after the completion/drawing: Marcin Schiele
pic 2: Constructional materials used to construction kadłuba kutra Giurza – ship’s steel (blue), many-layered kompozyt steel-aluminium (pink), armored steel (green) and light feet aluminium (yellow)/drawing: Marcin Schiele
pic 3: Prototype cruiser Dżajchun photographed during of river tests przeprowadzonych on the container Kaniowskim in October 2004/photograph: SRDSC
pic 4: Cruiser Sajchun (number burtowy 02) already on water Amu-Darli. Good visible pojazdowe moduły installed armament on deck rostral and stern/photograph: SRDSG
pic 5: Both desert moored vipers in the mother porcie Termez. They have much more oblique walls kazamatowej sterówki and burty, that protuberantly decreases their visibility in strands radar and optical/the photograph: SRDSC
pic 6: Approaching to uzbeckiego bank Amu-Darii Sajchun perfectly illustrates abilities to the natation on ekstremalnie shallow water and a effective concealment among a waterside vegetation/photograph: SRDSC
Sleep … I vaguely recall that concept :rolleyes:
Mum and bub are well, thx dude!
Last time they did a major (for them) deployment they sent some tugs as well. So no they don’t trust their ships.
What a lot of big conclusions over a small thing.
I think the Russian navy has a realistic view on the state of maintenance of its ships.
Given:
“23-MAR-04
In yet another blow to Russia’s beleaguered military, the navy’s commanding admiral ordered a nuclear-powered battle cruiser to return to port Tuesday for fear that “it could explode at any moment.”
Adm. Vladimir Kuroyedov said the Peter the Great, the flagship of the Northern Fleet, had become unseaworthy and dangerous. During a recent inspection he found the cruiser to be poorly maintained, including “the contents of the (on-board) nuclear reactor.”
http://www.accessmylibrary.com/coms2/summary_0286-7668831_ITM
How many major ports facilities would a Kirov class ship be allowed into, in case of a malfunction, it being nuclear powered and all? Even if she were properly maintained.
Given:
“Over 150 ships are powered by more than 220 small nuclear reactors and more than 12,000 reactor years of marine operation has been accumulated.
Most are submarines, but they range from icebreakers to aircraft carriers.
In future, constraints on fossil fuel use in transport may bring marine nuclear propulsion into more widespread use. So far, exaggerated fears about safety have caused political restriction on port access.”
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2030564/posts
Nuclear powered ships are exempt from various treaties governing port access that normally guarantee port access.
http://books.google.nl/books?id=qouCWyQ-ykcC&pg=PA56&lpg=PA56&dq=port+access+nuclear+powered+ships&source=bl&ots=YhtnEGTx6O&sig=C5xZYSldAwC59n6Tkg3va1U0HQk&hl=nl&sa=X&oi=book_result&resnum=10&ct=result (page 40 onwards)
So, I think taking along a tug/repair ship is a wise precaution, taken not solely because they don’t trust the state of their ships. It shows they are behaving rationally.
Swedish Navy
Corvette Force Being Prepared For EU Duty
That ship be a the Polish navy ORP Grom (423), a modernized “Orkan” class (NATO: BAL-COM-10 / Sassnitz) Fast Attack Craft Missile (Fast Patrol Boats). The hulls were built in VEB Peenewerft, Wolgast (former DDR) and equipped in Northern Shipyard in Gdańsk. Modernized by Thales. Note Swedish RBS-15 Mk-2 AShM (to be replaced by Mk.III in 2009-2012), Thales STING-EO and Saab Microwave Systems Sea Giraffe AMB surveillance radar. Also feature sa new Thales-supplied combat system (Tacticos).
http://www.navy.mw.mil.pl/index.php?akcja=orkan
http://www.thales-nederland.nl/nl/news/archive/2001/aug1-2001.shtml
http://www.aviationweek.com/aw/blogs/defense/index.jsp?plckController=Blog&plckScript=blogScript&plckElementId=blogDest&plckBlogPage=BlogViewPost&plckPostId=Blog%3A27ec4a53-dcc8-42d0-bd3a-01329aef79a7Post%3A1ac9f2d6-c014-45c1-b425-7841dab99fcf
Premodernization pics:
They have finished up a few leftovers from the cold war that were on the slips.
The only leftovers finished were a single Gepard corvette (project 1166.1) and up to 2 additional Neustrashimy/Korsar frigates (project 1154.0/1) being finished.
The two project 956EM for China were built new, as were the three Talwars for India and as are the follow on three currently being built (project1135.6). As are the Steregushchiy project 20380 ships. As are two escort vessels of Project 11661 Gepard-3.9 for Vietnam.
Because they haven’t (due to inadequate finance) , does that mean they can’t (given adequate finance)?
By analogy, the latest T-90 is still based on the T-72. Does that mean the russians can’t design and build an entirely new, modern MBT?
But seriously …
Thailand is >>>> there
here <<<<< Aden is
WHat are they fishing anyway
What’s a Thai trawler’s business in the Gulf of Aden?
That as maybe, and I never said that they were ‘bad’ ships. Simply that next to what is coming out of European and American yards they are somewhat backwards.
Very much agreed. But that doesn’t mean they could not be substantial steps forward over existing russian ship.
Better to work with more generous margins up front, and pay for the priviledge.
Absolutely!
Wanshan the 22350 frigate looks so much like Talwar class , infact if you just put aside the single arm Shtil-1 launcher on the talwar , nothing looks dissimilar.
I though 22350 will be a larger displacement size frigate/destroyer and would be far more stealthier , what is the source of this image ?
snake65 point taken 😉
Ask Snake65.
Gentlemen, I believe the drawings of the 22350 is just speculative artistic work (a naval equivalent to the PAK-FA photos). Do not draw conclusions from them.
Irrespective of how she will look, with this “far sea zone frigate” or “distant sea zone destroyer escort”, we’re talking about a (Severnoye) design of either around 8000 tons or around 4,500 tons, with 8 P-800 / SS-N-26 «Yakhont/Onyx» anti-ship missiles, «Medvedka 2» anti-submarine missiles, a medium range antiaircraft missile system, 1x 130-mm A-192 DP gun and 2x 30 mm CIWS.
http://www.naval-technology.com/contractors/warship/sener/press14.html
http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/world/russia/22350.htm
http://www.foransystem.com/FORAN/newsitem.aspx?id=cw99f344836f534b77bcc4
http://mdb.cast.ru/mdb/1-2006/industrial_policy/item2/
http://www.russ-news.com/news/2005/10/en131005
Given russian destroyers measure in at 8000 tons, for a frigate there are only 3 options:
– a project 1154 (Neustrashimy) derivative (4500 tons)
– a project 1135 (Krivak) derivative (4500 tons)
– totally new design
For a destroyer sized ship, there are two
– a project 1155 (Udaloy) derivative
– totally new design
Given the financial picture, a 4500 tons frigate to complement project 20380 corvettes makes more sense IMHO than a destroyer.
Below are 2 other purported project 22350 images. The leftmost matches the line drawing I posted earlier. The other one is somewhat different. However, even that shows more similarity with Krivak than Neustrashimy.
Officials have confirmed that the OPV Otago is already around 100 tons overweight and thus in trouble when it comes to performance, sea keeping, ice strengthened sections being lower in the water than planned etc.
I’d hazard the guess that all available margins have been blown and there is nothing left to add bigger guns, radars etc.
Hull plugs?
Atlas Cheetah D2 with a Russian Klimov SMR-95 engine (a development of the RD-33 used in the MiG-29)
Fair enough, and it reinforces my point.
Lineage does not necessarily make for poor ships. And there’s a world of difference between 11356 and 22350