WanshanI think Ka-226 is way too small for the Mistral class of ships. Even the Ka-62 is not big enough. The most fitting category is the Mi-8/17/14 class….
But I think, by the time the Mistrals is ready (around 2015-16), the replacement for the Mi-17 might also get ready. And by that I mean the Mi-383, the military variant of the Mi-38, with whole new fuselage and new engine.
I think Mi-383 is the helo that India and Russia is jointly developing? Mi-383 is in 15ton class where as the reports of the Indo-Russian JV for helo is of 10ton class…. can anyone clarify?
Mi-38 is a JV with Kazan, Mil Moscow Helicopter Plant, EADS/Eurocopter and Pratt & Whitney of Canada. Meanwhile, India has asked Russia to partner it in the development of a 10t-class battlefield helicopter to replace Mil Mi-24/25/35s. (= gunship + assault transport)
http://www.flightglobal.com/articles/2004/01/06/175847/euromils-mi-38-collaboration-makes-first-flight.html
http://www.flightglobal.com/articles/2007/01/30/211795/india-seeks-russian-help-with-combat-helicopter.html
WanshanBULGARIAN Navy News.. yes THAT Bulgaria!!
recently released documents from the US from the Telegraph reveal that the US suggests Bulgaria should not blow all its money on French corvettes (or French and Swedish fighters for that matter).. suggests older Belgian ships instead. All part of promoting Bulgarian military to transition itself to participate abroad in multi-national (NATO) combat operations.
As in Wielingen class ships. Suggestion was taken up, therefor.
WanshanThe tests constituted an absolute first in any test firing: APAR engaged two drones by guiding four missiles simultaneously to the targets, using only one of its four faces. And thanks to the system’s short reaction time and high accuracy, this face did not nearly reach its maximum capacity, leaving plenty of room for even more engagements.
http://www.thales-nederland.nl/nl/news/archive/2005/april26-2005.shtml
Your original
The performance of ICWI-based missile defence systems was convincingly demonstrated during the live firing trials of the Royal Netherlands Navy’s “De Zeven Provinciën” late 2003 and the live firing trials of the German Navy’s “Sachsen” mid 2004. Both ships are equipped with APAR, Thales Nederland’s highly advanced multifunction radar, especially designed to guide ESSM and SM2 missiles to incoming threats, using ICWI technology.
http://weapons.technology.youngester.com/2009/04/australian-department-of-defense-and.html
There should be at least two instances of some professional press info on it.
Each of the four arrays is devided into four independant quadrants, each of which has its own waveform generator and two missile guidance waveform generators (for both the missile uplink and terminal illumination). The array can, therefor, control the simultaneous engagement of up to four targets, managing up to eight missiles
Norman Friedman, The Naval Institute Guide to world naval weapon systems, p. 265-266
Now, I think that means for a typical installation with 4 arrays that you have the ability to track 16 targets while guiding 32 missiles, of which half in terminal stage and half midcourse. But it may be as you said “terminally guide 16 targets and provide midcourse corrections to 32 missiles”.
It can track up to 250 targets at one time, and at the same time can function as a illumination radar for up to 16 targets (with 32 missiles in the air), removing the need for separate illumination radars
http://www.seaforces.org/marint/Netherlands-Navy/Frigate/De-Zeven-Provincien-class.htm
missile guidance using the Interrupted Continuous Wave Illumination (ICWI) technique, thus allowing guidance of 32 semi-active radar homing missiles in flight simultaneously, including 16 in the terminal guidance phase
http://dictionary.sensagent.com/active+phased+array+radar/en-en/
THis quotes as source: Jane’s Navy International, October 2005, “Live firing tests rewrite the guiding principles”
Article details
Article title Live firing tests rewrite the guiding principles
Author Lok, J. J.
Journal title JANES NAVY INTERNATIONAL
Bibliographic details 2005, VOL 110; NUMB 8, pages 38-44
Publisher JANE’S INFORMATION GROUP INC Country of publication Great Britain
ISBN ISSN 1358-3719
Language English
http://direct.bl.uk/bld/PlaceOrder.do?UIN=175335103&ETOC=RN&from=searchengine
WanshanWhat are the yellow bulbs on the superstructure for? ESM equipment?
Mostly satcoms plus a surface targeting radar.
WanshanBrazil has 2 Thomastons (Ceará and Rio de Janeiro), aren’t you mixing up the two countries? Chile today has 2 BATRAL class landing ship tank (Rancagua and Chacabuco) and one Newport-class tank landing ship (Valdivia), this last ship is the one that’s due to be replaced by the Foudre.
In Brazil’s case our two Thomastons and the single Newport are scheduled to be replaced soon by four new BPCs Mistrals. I hope this plan comes to fruition.
Regards,
Hammer
Correct, don’t know why I got Brazil in my head on this. Late hour I suppose 😉
Nice swap though, 4 Mistrals en lieu of 2 Thomastons and a Newport …
As for Fourdre
” On 2010, the ship was offered to the Argentine Navy [1]. Argentina had already declined an offer for the Ouragan class before due asbestos concerns.”
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foudre_(L_9011)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foudre_class_landing_platform_dock
http://www.segurancaedefesa.com/Foudre2ARA.html
http://infodefensa.com/lamerica/noticias/noticias.asp?cod=2026&ref=Tierra&n=Argentina-y-Francia-hablan-de-cooperan-en-la-construcci%F3n-de-buque-anfibio-y-la-modernizaci%F3n-de-aviones-y-helic%F3pteros
So, I guess they declined (asbestos too? or couldn’t agree on price?) and the French offered to Chili (or were offered simultaneously and bid first) Or was one offerred Fourde and the other Scirocco?
WanshanChile eyes new amphibious transport ship
The Chilean Navy’s requirement for a landing platform dock (LPD)-type vessel has become more urgent after it decommissioned its main amphibious transport ship.Don’t we have an Albion coming up for sale?
They had 2 Thomaston-class dock landing ship, which date back to 1954! They may get some Anchorage class as replacements? These would be a good 15 years younger and could be obtained via US foreign military aid (i.e. real cheap if a hot transfer)
WanshanThanks for that – having had my head stuck in the sand for the past however many years I never realised that the Gr9 didnt have a radar ,…………….. sorry for being sarky but really.
The reason they should still look at the GR9 is that they need airframes. Tell me over the past 10 years when a Indian Harrier has actually been in action???? or likely to be before the Mig 29s are fully operational.
Now tell me if you think retiring the Harriers in UK is a good idea, no its not you lose skills. So how about India buys 15-20 GR9’s forgets about the fact that they dont have radar and uses them to fill the deck. You take 4/6 Indian Harriers out and the same GR9’s leaving the rest on rotation. You keep your pilots qualified and working off decks as well as the crew. AND you get to use a plane that’s ground attack from a carrier….something the Mig 29 can also do, so you develop you doctrine for that?
Is that such a silly idea?
AV-8B plus ?????
Wanshanthats good. that ship is such horrible condition, it shouldn’t even be sold.
instead, Russia should buy some Gayducks from Ukraine.
“Russia is agreeable to take away ship, if the Ukraine returns it gratis”
> to use it as spare parts hull?
> to refurb it? (if there are no acquisition costs, overal cost is lower)
“In 2005 the Ministers of Defense of Russia and Ukraine made a decision about the curtailment of the completion of ship because of the absence of the need of fleets of both states for such cruisers.”
i.e. use as spare parts hull.
Not in the last place because
“Completion and modernization of rocket cruiser is evaluated at 50 billion rubles. For the comparison, to these means it is possible to acquire four submarines of project 636 “[Varshavyanka]” or several frigates of project 20380. “
WanshanInteresting but it must be remembered that the USN operated a KH-31 variant the MA-31 from 1996 through to 2007 as an interim target drone solution. So they are well aware of its performance profile. I presume this is more about preventing the onsale of the missiles to an undesirable end customer.
Agree
Wanshanshe needs one more coat of paint before she heads out. If you gonna take your first aircraft carrir out for a spin, you want it looking good.
She won’t be heading out w/o the phased arrays I suspect. And there still appears a lot of electronic equipment not installed.
Wanshanwell im not the one saying it, its being openly disscused by USN naval planners. Besides there is no gauratee that you will be able to reley on Helico’s what if a bad storm front surges in and that grounds flight ops. having a shallow draft ship that can dock at a asutre pier wouldn’t be that bad.
The similarities between a Navy LCAC and an airplane are substantial. And just like helicopter operations, LCACs operations are weather sensitive:
“The LCAC operational seastate envelope includes full mission capability through sea state three, limited capability in sea state four, and survival in sea state five”
http://www.dtic.mil/dticasd/sbir/sttr03/n015.pdf
Dutch LPD ‘Rotterdam: “is capable of carrying out helicopter operations up to Sea State 6 while operations with (conventional) landing craft are possible up to Sea State 4.”
http://www.naval-technology.com/projects/rotterdam/
Dutch National Aerospace Laboratory ship-based helicopter flight tests in a range of rough sea conditions (up to sea state 6 during both daytime & at night) underlie these figures for helicopters.
http://www.nlr.nl/?id=9043&l=en
http://www.nlr.nl/smartsite.dws?l=en&ch=&id=9045
About LAMPS III operations from destroyers/frigates:
“Helicopter takeoffs and landings were limited to sea states in which the ship did not roll prohibitively.
Acceptable conditions occurred in the North Atlantic only 69 percent of the time during winter or less considering precipitation, icing and limited visibility.
Frigates were more affected than destroyers and could operate helicopters just 25 percent of the time in the same seas.
…
The Canadian RAST (recovery assist, secure and traversing) system was installed for landing and flight deck handling of the heavier SH-60B helicopters.
RAST supported helicopter operations during sea state 5 conditions that would ground helicopters flying from conventional shipboard flight decks.”
http://www.navsource.org/archives/01/57s3.htm
WanshanWell there were complaints about the Mercy’s response times during the Haitian crisis last year, and both ships are fairly expenses to maintain and getting long in the tooth. There has been talk in some ‘real’ naval circles that the next hospital ship should be a high speed shallow draft vessel of some kind. Also until recently the idea was that the a modified LPD-17 would of taken up that role but due to rising costs and other issues that is being reevaluated. I personally think a well deck would be a attractive feature on a medical ship,but the T-AKE is just simply cheaper, as well as some modified foreign Amphibs, (especially the Mistral or Bay class.) Lastly, China has once again proven you do not necessary need a milspec ship for ever role.
Don’t see any need for shallow draft and dock as medivac is mostly by heli. A modified fast container ship would do nicely IMHO.
WanshanJapan’s Policies on the Control of Arms Exports
http://www.mofa.go.jp/policy/UN/disarmament/policy/index.html
Interestingly, the Ministry of Economy, Trade and Industry (METI) controls Japan’s “arms” exports, based on the Foreign Exchange and Foreign Trade Law.
Japan considers lifting ban on arms exports (WP, October 15, 2010)
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/10/14/AR2010101406537.html
WanshanMercy class: http://www.navy.mil/navydata/fact_display.asp?cid=4400&tid=400&ct=4
Both these hospital ships are converted San Clemente-class super tankers.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/93198821@N00/244888709/
What’s wrong with this approach? Tankers aplenty, I would say.
Wanshanwhy not good ol’ Hip again ? especially Mi-14 Haze variants, amphibious and already navalized….
or even Mi-26… 😀 as Mistral have huge chopperdeck unlike udaloy….
Mil teamed up with Kazan Helicopters and Eurocopter to build a new heavy lift helicopter in the 15 ton-class, the Euromil Mi-38. The helicopter is offered with a choice of either Klimov TV7-117V or Pratt & Whitney Canada PW127/TS tuboshaft engines. Production is expected to begin in 2013. So, why not the Mi-38?
http://www.defenseindustrydaily.com/Russias-Mi-38-Stopgap-Heli-Gets-Go-Ahead-Funding-05333/
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