SabreAce,

the point with this is that it would appear the Tweets were never bought in 1976 when transferred to the PAF from USAF stocks. They must have been supplied under an MAP/MDP programme with no money changing hands at the time. This transfer of 19 to Pakistan, so they can then pass them on to Bangladesh, is just paperwork/bureaucracy catching-up with reality.

Incidentally, each T-37B is valued at $20,374.60…strange figure but that represents 10% of the original cost in 1957-60 when these were procured by the USAF.

Bangladesh received 12 T-37B direct from USAF stocks in a similar manner back in 1995 when each aircraft was valued at $167, 935.

I assume the PAF are continuing with their T-37C and just passing-on the surviving B models to Bangladesh.

Best regards

Steve Rush ~ Touchdown-News

Re: lolo

Originally posted by PILOTGHT
“Just check the website of Boeing and Airbus. Airbus has alot more orders in backlog but i think due recent currency changes the situation is going to change very rapidly.”

ha ha ha ! niah! all airbus ares sold in dollars! hey!!

and a sheeet, even cheap stay a sheeet!

lol

and this from the country that builds the ATR!

I completely agree with that, Ja.

A Flanker is around 5 metres longer (yes, really!) and over 2 metres taller than an Su-25.

Okay, perspective and distance could be a factor but, in this case, the mystery aircraft is parked between the first and second set of floddlight pylons so it must be taking-up the next parking space to the 3rd Frogfoot.

Also, and this would make the Flanker even more obvious, the photo isn’t taken from ground level but from a fairly high vantage point (steps or a generator?). The last Flanker I saw on the deck was at Bratislava last year and you could see the thing standing above the rest of the static aircraft from about 1/2 mile down the taxiway!

One last thing, isn’t the shape of the tip of the Flanker’s tail more distinctive than that in the photo? It doesn’t look angled to me, but a better shot would have been nice as Arthur mentioned.

Best regards

Steve Rush ~ Touchdown-News

Originally posted by Indian1973
what is the price of a new AH-1Z compared to the $6.6mil for AH-1F? how old are these airframes?

Ahhh okay, Usman, that makes a lot more sense then. From the paperwork it would seem that Pakistan didn’t actually own them which is why the transfer must have needed congressional approval.

The unit acquisition value of $6.6 million is what each AH-1 cost the US Army when they were brand new, Indian. Current unit value is $956,000 each. The Cobras being passed-on through this programme date mostly from 1978 to 1981.

Okay, from what I’ve been reading on these Grant Authority transfers the recipient doesn’t actually pay for the hardware and it’s taken “as is and where is”. Meaning that any upgrade, overhaul and transportation costs are met by the end user. These, however, can be purchased and paid for under FMS.

Best regards

Steve Rush ~ Touchdown-News

The Fishbed being auctioned is the one in the photo on that page: 8004 MiG-21MF ex Polish AF.

It used to be at a place called Nieuwekerk aan der Ijssel outside a big truck dealers called van Vliet.

I could say that I saw it there on 15th October 2002 whilst on the way from Florennes (TLP 2002/5) to Leeuwarden and then Twente (for exercise Frisian Flag) but that would be a complete and utter lie as I have never set foot on a cross-channel ferry…..apparently. 😀

Toedeldokie!

Steve Rush ~ Touchdown-News

p.s. Ja..maybe the MiG-21 in Aus is airworthy?

Well, well, well…..

Who fancies a “scoop”?

After digging around in some dark and dusty corners I unearthed the following which may be of interest to a few of you who frequent the forum:

Fiscal Year: 2003 Country: Pakistan Implementing Agency: Department of the Army Type of Transfer: Grant Authority
Item: AH-1F Helicopters
Congressional Notification Sent: 16th July, 2003 Quantity Allocated: 40 Unit Acquisition Value: $6,604,397
Congressional Expiration: 15th August, 2003 Quantity Accepted: 0 Total Acquisition Value: $264,175,880
Authorized to Supply: 19th August, 2003 Quantity Rejected: 0 Unit Current Value: $956,825
Total Quantity Delivered: 0 Total Current Value: $38,273,000

Fiscal Year: 2003 Country: Pakistan Implementing Agency: Department of the Army Type of Transfer: Grant Authority
Item: UH-1H Helicopters
Congressional Notification Sent: 16th July, 2003 Quantity Allocated: 40 Unit Acquisition Value: $922,704
Congressional Expiration: 15th August, 2003 Quantity Accepted: 0 Total Acquisition Value: $36,908,160
Authorized to Supply: 19th August, 2003 Quantity Rejected: 0 Unit Current Value: $92,720
Total Current Value: $3,708,800

I’m not completely up-to-scratch on what a “Grant Authority” transfer represents, but I’m pretty certain Pakistan won’t be paying very much for these. The other surpise I got was finding the transfer, under the same funding, for the surviving 19 from the batch of 26 T-37B Tweets that were supplied back in 1976! I assume they were provided under a MAP and never paid for and it’s now a case of paperwork catching-up with “real life”.

By the way, no notification of actual delivery of these 80 choppers has been made yet and it’s by no means guaranteed that Pakistan will accept all of them. Time will tell…… 🙂

Best regards

Steve Rush ~ Touchdown-News

Ministry of Defence

This Government is continuing to deliver a modern and flexible capability able to meet today’s challenges, promoting international peace and security and combating international terrorism by:

* raising the defence budget by £3.5 billion between now and 2005-06, providing 1.2 per cent annual average real growth – the largest planned increase in defence spending in twenty years;
* enabling the Ministry of Defence to continue to deliver the 1998 Strategic Defence Review and the Strategic Defence Review New Chapter;
* providing the Armed Forces with new investment in battle-winning technologies, enabling them to stand shoulder-to-shoulder with our allies in the war against international terrorism;
* acting as a force for good at home and continuing to make an effective contribution to global conflict prevention;
* modernising and reforming the way in which the Ministry of Defence organises and manages its support to the front line to enable it to deliver military capability more efficiently and at lower unit cost; and
* re-directing resources for new investment in defence priorities by continuing to dispose of surplus assets in the defence estate through rationalisation and improved asset use.

INVESTING IN DEFENCE FOR THE 21ST CENTURY
————————————————————————
Largest increase in defence spending plans for 20 years

12.1__The 2002 Spending Review provides the biggest planned increase in the defence budget for twenty years. This provides an average of 1.2 per cent a year real growth for the Ministry of Defence over the next three years. Defined on an historically comparable near-cash basis, the Ministry of Defence’s budget will grow by 1.7 per cent on average a year in real terms. This will enable the Ministry of Defence to continue to deliver the 1998 Strategic Defence Review (SDR) and will provide for substantial new investment in the SDR “New Chapter”. This will provide our Armed Forces with the latest technology and network centric capabilities, enabling them to act together with our allies in the war against international terrorism and to achieve greater precision and control of military operations. It will enable our Armed Forces to continue to achieve success in the tasks they undertake now and will enable them to respond to the range of contingencies envisaged in the SDR.

12.2__Challenging PSA targets have been agreed covering the success of military operations (including those providing support to civil communities), and improving the effectiveness of our contributions to conflict prevention. Targets relating to the readiness at which our Armed Forces are able to respond to crises and the delivery of more capable, battle-winning technology, equipment and systems for the future have also been agreed.

Building strong defences for the future

12.3__The 1998 SDR set out a radical modernisation programme of the UK Armed Forces. The objective was to provide more capable, more flexible and better equipped forces to fulfil the Government’s commitment to strong defence and to support foreign policy objectives. Despite the demanding commitments which our Armed Forces have fulfilled with distinction in the last few years, the implementation of the SDR is now well advanced and the Government is on track to meet its objectives.

Modernisation and reform of front line forces

12.4__Following the events of 11 September 2001, the Defence Secretary commissioned work on a “New Chapter” to the SDR to ensure that the UK has the right forces and the right capabilities to meet the additional new strategic challenges facing the UK. This work is now complete. While the New Chapter has confirmed that the original conclusions of the SDR, taken together with lessons learnt from our subsequent experiences in Kosovo and Afghanistan, remain valid, the Government has concluded that further, additional, funding is necessary to ensure that our Armed Forces have the equipment and capabilities they need to respond to the challenges of a changing world. The Government has therefore made available over £1 billion of new capital and £0.5 billion of new resources for new network-centric capabilities and other equipment which will enable the conclusions of the SDR New Chapter to be delivered. The Secretary of State for Defence will announce further details shortly.

Modernisation and reform of business processes

12.5__An additional £578 million over three years is also being made available to modernise the Ministry of Defence’s business information systems, especially in the Defence Logistics Organisation, to improve support to the front line. This will enable the Ministry of Defence to operate more effectively and will help it to meet its efficiency targets.

Getting better value for defence spending

12.6__The Ministry of Defence continues to look at ways of making defence spending more cost-effective. Procurement techniques are continuing to be over-hauled and, together, the Defence Procurement Agency and the Defence Logistics Organisation will continue to take forward Smart Acquisition to provide the Armed Forces with the equipment it needs on time, to budget and to meet capability requirements more effectively. The Defence Logistics Organisation faces a huge challenge to modernise its working methods so that capability requirements can be met more effectively and at a significantly lower unit cost. A target has been agreed with the Ministry of Defence to deliver 21/2 per cent output efficiencies per annum. This target is underpinned by an output based measurement system that will also provide greater incentives for management improvements. Resources freed up by this will be re-invested in defence.

Table 12.1: Key figures

……………………………………………………………….£ million
……………………………………………..2002/3 2003/4 2004/5 2005/6
MoD Resource Budget…………………31,376 33,016 33,755 34,690
Capital Budget…………………………… 5,549 6,009 6,327 6,880
Total Dept. Expenditure Limit (1)……….29,326 30,921 31,756 32,779
Near-cash spending in MoD (2) ………….24,196 25,579 26,479 27,389

1 Full resource budgeting basis, net of depreciation.
2 Consistent with previous control basis.

Thoughtful post, as always, Steve

the only problem I can forsee is….what do the MoD do if the US DoD decide not to go for STOVL F-35s? That’s certainly being discussed and, as ELP has alluded to a couple of times, even the whole concept of USMC/USN TACAIR assets may be completely re-assessed.

IF the Navy end up with complete control of TACAIR in the future they are not going to go for STOVL as they won’t need it on the CVNs.

ELP, SOC et all will be better placed to know how seriously these ideas are being discussed and how high up the foodchain they go.

Cheers

Steve Rush ~ Touchdown-News

p.s. Je t’adore the thought of FAA Rafale Ms! 😀 But then I always have done as I wrote here over a year ago when I think we last discussed the Anglo-French talks over three new carriers (2 for UK, 1 for France).