archierafHi Dave,
It is the Commonwealth War Graves Commission who are responsible for the care and maintenance of all the CWGC graves and cemeteries. The text below is from their website:
The Commission is a maintenance organisation dealing with the graves, cemeteries and memorials commemorating those Commonwealth servicemen and women who died during the two world wars. It also has a responsibility to keep and maintain records of the fallen. Naturally, the Commission is aware that its work is dependent on the support of the governments and people of the Commonwealth and for their continued commitment to the principle of remembrance.
The Commonwealth War Graves Commission was established by Royal Charter on 21 May 1917, the provisions of which are now amended and extended by a Supplemental Charter of June 1964. Its duties are to mark and maintain the graves of the members of the forces of the Commonwealth who died in the two World Wars, to build memorials to those who have no known grave or who perished at sea and to keep records and registers.The cost of the work is shared by the member governments – Australia, Britain, Canada, India, New Zealand and South Africa – in proportions based on the numbers of their graves. Other Commonwealth countries contribute by carrying out the routine care and maintenance of graves and memorials in their own lands. The High Commissioners from each of the member governments are represented on the governing body of the Commission along with other Commissioners appointed by Her Majesty the Queen.To enable the Commission to carry out its world-wide task efficiently and effectively, in addition to the work carried out at Head Office, it has also established offices where there are major concentrations of Commonwealth war graves.
While they do seem to work hard at caring and maintaining the graves in cemeteries which contain many CWGC graves, they seem to slip up on the many CWGC graves that are scattered around in fewer numbers in cemeteries that are not purely CWGC owned. When I’ve visited cemeteries that contain large numbers of CWGC graves I have always been very impressed at the way in which the headstones and the grounds surrounding them have been kept. The same cannot be said for the CWGC headstones that I’ve visited in other cemeteries where they may be the only one, or one of only a handful.
I don’t know what the CWGC policy is on the care and maintenance of these other headstones. I would imagine that they have the same duty of care for them all but from a practical point of view they are not managing to keep up with looking after then in the way that they should. Maybe someone else knows more about it?
Good luck with the cleaning Steve, and good on ya mate 🙂
archierafHi and welcome flounder al. Is it a particular MacRoberts Reply you are looking for info on or just MacRoberts Reply in general?
archierafAt a quick glance through Bomber Command Losses for the dates mentioned above I can’t see anything that ties in although there was a 15 Sqdn Stirling on Air Test that came a cropper 29th Dec. but your man is not mentioned on the crew.
Have to go out now and won’t be back until tomorrow evening but will have a closer look then if nobody else has come up with anything.
archierafOk Dave, leaving all those people who don’t have English as their first language aside, I do, to a degree, see your point. It is easier to read something that is well written and does not contain spelling and grammar errors.
I’m sure that you are right when you say that many of the errors are due to a lack of care and attention to detail, but I would also say that some folk just find writing does not come naturally. You can find people who talk very eloquently but who are incapable of transferring the same skill into the written word with correct spelling and grammar. Writing well is a skill. It can either be a natural skill that someone has or something that they have developed over time by putting in hard work and effort. I personally find spelling correctly a bit of a problem but with the help of dictionaries and spell checkers I normally manage to get it right (but not all of the time).
I think the degree of care that people take with the written word depends on where they are using it, just as with the spoken word. With friends or family we are relaxed, informal and may often use slang or less formal spoken English, whereas, at work, in a job interview or in more formal situations the way you use the language changes. The same applies to when you write. You wouldn’t use written English in the same way on a job application as you would for a post on this forum for instance (well, certainly I wouldn’t). With a job application I would take the time and care to ensure that everything was correct, whereas, posting here on the forum it’s more relaxed, informal and spontaneous (or at least it should be). Yes, it would be nice if all the postings had everything correctly spelt etc, but I would rather have someone’s view/opinion/information on a thread to read no matter how many errors it contained than have them not bother to post because they didn’t feel their use of the written language was up to scratch or because it would take them too long to check all their spelling and grammar before posting.
I don’t know that it’s totally fair to blame younger generations poor spelling on having their brains dulled by too much use of text language. Perhaps it does have a part to play, but more fundamental is the education system which (certainly in the UK) seems to be constantly changing so one year the ‘in’ method is ‘look and learn’ (you have to look at the whole word and know what it says!) and the next year ‘phonetics’ is in. There doesn’t seem to be any consistency or flexibility.
Newspapers, books, websites, yes please get spelling and grammar right, but on forums etc I’m happy just to be able to communicate with others from around the globe and as long as we can understand one another I’m a happy bunny. 🙂
archierafDave, the nearest I can find to the name you gave in the timescale is this:
22 Nov 1942 1651 HCU Stirling I BF333 -R took off Waterbeach for a night x-c, during which the starboard inner failed. As the bomber lost height, two of the crw baled out but their colleagues remained aboard and were not too seriously hurt in the ensuing crash landing, at around 0140, a mile of so NNE of Portabello Farm on the Old Roman Road, one and a hlaf miles WSW from Shipston-on-Stour, Warwickshire. Three, Sgts Banyer, Pattison and Jennings went, eventually, to 15 Sqdn where they joined another RNZAF Pilot, P/O J H Stowell. Sadly all three died (as did their skipper) on 4-5 May 1943.
Crew:
Sgt C K Easton RNZAF (sic)
SGt E Kirby
Sgt J B T Williams inj
Sgt J Banyer
Sgt L H Pattison inj
Sgt W Jennings inj
Sgt N R Hutchins RAAF inj
As you can see, there is no Easter on the crew, but I wondered if Chorley may have been working from poorly printed documents and has taken G K Easter to be C K Easton?
Do the other details tie in with the info you already have? I’ll make the correction to the name in my copy of the book if they do.
archierafDave, if you can give me a date or the name of the airman I’ll look up HCU losses by W R Chorley and let you know if it has a crash location (it should certainly have the a/c no).
archierafThink how lucky you all are that you can tell the difference between these words with ease and how easy it is for you to write the English language. It may take you but a few seconds to dash off a witty response to a post and you do so without a second thought.
Please spare a thought for those who may have English as their first language but who, for one reason or another struggle with it in the written form. It’s probably taken them long enough to pluck up the courage to post something publicly.
For those who post here that don’t have English as their first language I take my hat off to you and commend you for your use of the language.
It’s all about communication. This is a public forum, so long as we can understand one another I don’t see what the big deal is.
archierafA quick ‘Google’ for 107 Squadron or 186 Squadron will throw up enough pages for you to get a fair bit of background info on them for starters.
According to the book RAF Squadrons by Wing Commander C G Jefford 107 Squadron were operating Blenheim IV’s at the time your man was killed and 186 Squadron were operating Hurricane IV’s in Oct 43.
Unfortunately it would appear that there are no Squadron Associations currently active for either of these Squadrons. The Squadron Associations are often a good starting point.
I noted (after checking on CWGC) that both men were from Sussex. The fact that Homewood is buried in the UK almost certainly means that he died in the UK. Airmen were not repatriated for burial at this time (or at least I’ve never heard of this happening). For further information about Homewood it might be worth contacting the local register of deaths for the cemetery he lies in. Often their records will have some information about the circumstances of their death.
The Service Number for Barton seems unusual. I don’t know enough about Service Numbers to be able to tell you anything other than that but there are plenty people who can. Try posting a request for info about these two airmen on the following site and include the Service No’s. http://www.rafcommands.com/cgi-bin/dcforum/dcboard.cgi?az=list&forum=DCForumID6&conf=DCConfID1
A visit to the local library to hunt through their archives might produce something and it’s also worth while checking out any newspaper archives in the local area. Don’t forget to start with the obvious……. ie: ask around at the hospital to find out if there is anyone there who might know about any medical background they might have had or if there may be any record of former employees who served during the war etc.
Hope that helps a bit, good luck.
archierafYou need to have the scanned photographs stored on your machine. Make sure that they are not too large (can’t find a note of max file sizes and dimensions for this forum but someone else will probably know). The following file extensions are acceptable bmp doc gif jpe jpeg jpg pdf png psd txt zip with jpeg or jpg being the most common for images posted.
When you start a new post or click to reply to a post scroll down under the ‘Reply to Thread’ box and you will see an ‘Additional Options’ panel.
Click on ‘Manage Attachments’ then click on the ‘Browse’ button to find the file you want to attach. Once the file has been selected click on ‘Upload’.
Hope this helps
archierafStill quite a bit here and lovin’ it 😀
archierafYou are very welcome Steve. If possible, can you post back with how you got on (a) with cleaning the headstone, and (b) with ordering a wreath. It would be interesting to hear your experience re both and might be helpful for others considering a similar task in the future.
archierafSteve, the info I posted was from this page http://www.thepressdesk.com/britishlegion/tab.php?tabid=2769 looks like you’ll need to call the number given and ask to be pointed in the right direction.
I also found contact details for two places called The Poppy Factory:
Lady Haigs Poppy Factory, Edinburgh, Tel: 0131 550 1573 or E-Mail: [email]secretary@lhpfscotland.org.uk[/email]
and
The Poppy Factory, Tel: 020 8940 3305 (looks like a London number.)
Both the above manufacture poppy wreaths, crosses etc.
Good luck and well done for your efforts.
archierafSteve, that’s excellent news. Good to hear that both the CWGC and your local Council have been so helpful. As for a wreath, suggest you try your local British Legion or use the contact details below from the British Legion Website. I’m sure someone there will be able to help you.
Poppies, Poppy Wreaths and Badged Little Remembrance Crosses
Anyone needing poppies, a poppy wreath or a ‘badged’ Little Remembrance Cross (LRX) (a basic LRX with the poppy removed and replaced by a badge of whatever regiment / ship / squadron / organisation / school etc.) should make contact with either their local Poppy Appeal Organiser or the staff at:
The Poppy Appeal
Royal British Legion Village
Aylesford
Kent ME20 7NX
Telephone 01622 717172
There are ten different standard wreath designs, some of which may be supplied with a badge in the centre. Additionally it is also possible to attach an inscribed ribbon to most of the wreaths.
In order to avoid charging VAT we do not quote a price for our wreaths or Little Remembrance Crosses. Instead we make them available in return for a voluntary donation which, if given, will at least cover our production and delivery costs; requested donations for wreaths are quoted on our order form. The order form contains pictures of the different types of wreaths available. The requested donation price for badged Little Remembrance Crosses is £3. They are both intended for all year round use.
It is not presently possible to order wreaths via this website.
archierafGlad to be of service. :p
Be careful of loudly exclaiming “Spuds out for the lads”, or “Show’s yer King Edward’s doll?” next time you have an all male night out. 😀
I don’t think there’s any danger of that, I am already equipped with my own 😮
archierafNot to be confused with ‘tottie’ which can either be a potato or a collective of attractive females. 😀
😮 never thought of that. Will be v. careful in future 😀
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