nJayMYes it does but these are the facts we (the world) have been waiting for
The Prelim makes for scary reading. It went from run of the mill to crazy in only a few minutes.
The calculated impact speed is 168MPH. It’s safe to say no one survived more than a few seconds post impact.
What is a shame though, is that the PAx and Crew had 3mins of sheer terror as the plane fell from beneath them. Those poor, poor souls.
Hi Sandy
Yes it does sound very scary but these are the facts we (the world) have been waiting for and they make grim reading and even more grim news is yet to unfold in the next few week and months.
The velocity of 168 mph is one aspect but the acceleration has been estimated as being also phenomenal and the angle at which the entire aircraft hit the water would start to explain the way the debris is distributed.
The poor souls on board did not suffer long. RIP
The reasons for why the nose could not be pointed downwards (thereby reduce the effect of the stall) is yet to be fully explained and whether this was due to a fault on the aircraft as opposed to crew handling is what is awaited in future reports.
I hope all airline manufacturers pay respect to the findings from this tragedy as they have been obtained at great expense and supreme effort and the results must serve the world with enhancements that are implemented as soon as practical.
nJayM[QUOTE=topspeed;1750862]How far were the engines apart from each other when found…and where was the rudder..it seemed pretty much in one piece when found floating.
Why did it take 1 min 30 sec for the chief pilot to get into cockpit ? How far is the rest area from cockpit ?
QUOTE]
There is a complete debris field chart at – http://www.bea.aero/fr/enquetes/vol.af.447/presentation12mai2011.pdf
As for why it took 1min 30 sec for the Captain to gain access into the cockpit under modern anti terrorist conditions of cockpit security does not add any negative aspect or controversy to the tragedy.
The Captain Marc Dubois was on a legitimate break and although his proximity to the cockpit would not be far it was unlikley that he in any way deliberately delayed. It would be extremely disrespectful to a deceased Captain of his seniority for us to speculate that he acted in anything other than an absolutely professional way.
Let’s wait on more facts from the BEA.
nJayMNew findings (interim) from BEA on 27 May 2011
New findings (interim) from BEA on 27 May 2011
http://www.bea.aero/fr/enquetes/vol.af.447/point.enquete.af447.27mai2011.en.pdf
“..New findings
At this stage of the investigation, as an addition to the BEA interim reports of 2 July and 17 December 2009, the following new facts have been established:
ˆ-The composition of the crew was in accordance with the operator’s procedures.
ˆ-At the time of the event, the weight and balance of the airplane were within the operational limits.
ˆ- At the time of the event, the two co-pilots were seated in the cockpit and the Captain was resting. The latter returned to the cockpit about 1 min 30 after the disengagement of the autopilot.
ˆ-There was an inconsistency between the speeds displayed on the left side and the integrated standby instrument system (ISIS). This lasted for less than one minute.
ˆ-After the autopilot disengagement:the airplane climbed to 38,000 ft,
–the stall warning was triggered and the airplane stalled,
–the inputs made by the PF were mainly nose-up,
–the descent lasted 3 min 30, during which the airplane remained stalled. The angle of attack increased and remained above 35 degrees,
–the engines were operating and always responded to crew commands.
-The last recorded values were a pitch attitude of 16.2 degrees nose-up, a roll angle of 5.3*degrees left and a vertical speed of -10,912 ft/min.”
http://www.bea.aero/fr/enquetes/vol.af.447/info27mai2011.en.php
states –
“… This note describes in a factual manner the chain of events that led to the accident and presents newly established facts. The initial analyses will be developed in a further interim report that is scheduled to be published towards the end of July….”
nJayMI second this – its been covered in Commercial Aviation
Merger please!
Mods please –
I second this – its been covered in Commercial Aviation
nJayMA news item today from BEA in French – please bear with my translation
A news item today (25 may 2011) from BEA in French – please bear with my translation (and anyone who can better it please feel free). This is the first since 17 May 2011 regarding Le Figaro.
http://www.bea.aero/fr/enquetes/vol.af.447/vol.af.447.php
“Information, 25 mai 2011
Le BEA publiera une note d’information sur les premières constatations résultant de l’exploitation des enregistreurs de vol. Cette note sera mise en ligne vendredi 27 mai en début d’après-midi et sera disponible en allemand, anglais, français et portugais. Il n’y aura pas de point presse.”
Translated the most salient part is
“…that the first results of the analysis of the flight recorders will be posted on-line Friday May 27 at the beginning of afternoon and will be available in German, English, French and Portuguese….”
Progress in my opinion – slow but steady.
nJayM787 flight test programme making solid headway – addition of ZA102
787 flight test programme making solid headway – addition of ZA102 to test fleet
Here’s the scoreboard up to 23 May 2011 –
Airplane Flights Hours
ZA001 465 1,149 hrs., 35 min.
ZA002 267 788 hrs., 05 min.
ZA003 139 456 hrs., 30 min.
ZA004 222 561 hrs., 30 min.
ZA005 213 592 hrs., 45 min.
ZA006 60 203 hrs., 40 min.
ZA102 14 22 hrs., 05 min.
TOTAL 1,380 3,775 hrs., 55 min.
nJayMThe leak in Die Spiegel only confirms what was already known
The leak in Die Spiegel only confirms what was already known was that when the Captain’s body was one of the first 50 found, it was obvious he was on his scheduled rest break and not in the cockpit, strapped in the Left Hand seat, when the crisis unfolded.
There is nothing at this stage to suspect anything about this likely fact, quite normal for flight crews to have rest breaks on long haul – in fact mandatory.
It’s again sensationalist reporting, and we await formal release from BEA between now and summer – Interim Report.
nJayMExcellent move – maybe a token fee payment enthusiasts section too
Excellent move – maybe a token fee payment enthusiasts section too.
nJayMMaybe a failed dry run for President Obama’s visit
Maybe a failed dry run for President Obama’s visit
nJayMHe’ll probably claims his roots and put down roots
He’ll probably claims his roots and put down roots
More likely he’ll climb aboard AF1 and head off Westward beating the ash cloud.
And do G8 by video link.
nJayMI did post this on the 15 April 2011 – EasyJet Trialling Ash Detector
I did post this on the 15 April 2011 – EasyJet Trialling Ash Detector
A detector has been installed on the wing-tip of an EasyJetAirbus A319 (G-EZBG), in place of the left wing-fence as Ash detector team scouts volcanic zones for trial.
http://www.flightglobal.com/articles…for-trial.html
Supposedly researched by
http://www.nilu.no/index.cfm?lan_id=3
nJayMSounds good but how will they prioritise when the demands grow?
Sounds good but how will they prioritise when the demands grow?
One helicopter will not be sufficient to serve the needs of the UK even with the restriction of it being for babies and children.
nJayMHere is an excellent paper if you wish to know more …
What are your thoughts on this?
Hi Kabir
Here is an excellent paper (its from Cranfield) on Airlines and Fuel ‘Hedging’
My bets are on fuel economic aero engines and aerodynamic enhancements, alternative fuels for aero engines, and in the long term future completely revolutionary designs.
Along with this first line military usage of UCAVs as they are lighter and far more fuel efficient.
As for Low Cost Model or conventional carrier the implications are the same – nothing stays still when crude oil climbs – so a LCC ticket at say £1 may be £1.50 next year
nJayMStern words from BEA after Le Fiagro report irresponsibly on 16 May 2011
Stern words from BEA after Le Fiagro report irresponsibly on 16 May 2011
http://www.bea.aero/fr/enquetes/vol.af.447/com17mai2011.en.php
Quite right too, in any circumstances irresponsible reporting by the press is to be deplored but in these sensitive moments for patiently waiting bereaved it is an absolute nonsense.
The facts will be revealed but it isn’t needing sensationalised.
nJayMOfficial news from BEA – data downloaded – analysis to begin
Re-affirming the above previous post
Data downloaded – analysis to begin
http://www.bea.aero/fr/enquetes/vol.af.447/info16mai2011.en.php
BEA 16 May 2011 briefing
“Following operations to open, extract, clean and dry the memory cards from the flight recorders, BEA Safety Investigators were able to download the data over the weekend.
These operations were filmed and recorded in their entirety. This was done in the presence of two German investigators from BFU, an American investigator from NTSB, two British investigators from AAIB and two Brazilian investigators from CENIPA, as well as an officer from the French judicial police and a court expert.
These downloads gathered all of the data from the Flight Data recorder (FDR), as well as the whole recording of the last two hours of the flight from the Cockpit Voice Recorder (CVR).
In the framework of the safety investigation directed by the BEA, all of this data will now be subjected to detailed in-depth analysis.
This work will take several weeks, after which a further interim report will be written and then published during the summer.
This is good news about a tragedy the world awaits facts on.
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