star49http://afp.google.com/article/ALeqM5hehSCYSVzlki-FV4apSbJlllfCug
Russia conducts ballistic missile tests
8 hours ago
MOSCOW (AFP) — Russia test-fired three long-range missiles on Sunday and pronounced its nuclear deterrent strong in a show of force that experts said had not been seen since the days of the Cold War.
Two of the missiles were fired from nuclear submarines in the Asian and European extremes of the sprawling country while a third was watched by President Dmitry Medvedev on land in northwest Russia, news agencies reported.
It was the second Russian intercontinental ballistic missile (ICBM) test in as many days and the latest in a series of high-profile military exercises of conventional land, sea and air forces as well as strategic nuclear units.
“This shows that our deterrent is in order,” Medvedev was quoted by RIA Novosti news agency as saying after Sunday’s missile launches.
“We will of course be introducing new types of forces and means into the military,” he added, without elaborating.
Independent military analyst Pavel Felgenhauer said the exercises reflected Russia’s determination to prepare for major military conflict.
“This was a dry run for a war with the United States,” Felgenhauer said of the missile launches, part of major military manoeuvres billed “Stability 2008” involving all military branches.
“These are the biggest strategic war games in more than 20 years. They are on a parallel with those held in the first half of the 1980s. Nothing of the sort has been seen either in Russia or the United States since then,” he said.
Russian navy spokesman Igor Dygalo confirmed the near-simultaneous ICBM test-launches from submarines in the Sea of Okhotsk north of Japan and the Barents Sea northeast of Norway, saying they had been planned well in advance.
Speaking to AFP from northwest Russia, Dygalo admitted it was unusual for the navy to conduct three ICBM test launches in two days — a submarine in the Barents Sea also fired a missile Saturday — and called the tests successful.
“The missiles hit right on target,” he said. News agencies said the missiles launched from the Barents Sea and the secret base at Plesetsk hit targets on the Kamchatka peninsula thousands of kilometres (miles) to the east.
The missile fired from the Sea of Okhotsk hit on target near Kanin Nos, a finger of land jutting into the White Sea in extreme northwest Russia, the reports said.
The Sineva missile launched Saturday — an exercise also watched by Medvedev from aboard an aircraft carrier — travelled more than 11,500 kilometres (7,145 miles) in what the Russian president claimed was an all-time distance record.
The missile tests came a day after Russia announced that a small naval flotilla led by the nuclear battlecruiser Pyotr Veliky (Peter the Great) had paid a call at the Libyan port of Tripoli.
The ships, including a submarine destroyer and support vessels, were to conduct exercises at unspecified locations in the Mediterrannean Sea before heading toward Venezuela for joint exercises there in November, officials said.
Two Russian Tupolev-162 strategic bombers — each capable of carrying 12 cruise missiles armed with single 200-megaton nuclear warheads — carried out exercises in Venezuela last month.
Last week, Japan scrambled a pair of US-made F-15 fighters to intercept and escort Russian bombers on patrol near, but not inside, Japanese territorial waters.
The Kremlin, alarmed and angered over new US missile defence plans in eastern Europe and the expansion of the US-led NATO alliance into countries once allied with Moscow, has stressed for a year that it will respond in kind.
Washington has shrugged off Russian moves over the past 18 months to resume strategic bomber patrols around the world and reactivate use of its navy to project power on the seas, questioning if the hardware was up to the task
star49so there you have, Sukhoi believes stealth is important
unlike you who keep claiming it is already obsolete
if it was already obsolete, why bother incorporating it?
These are some of crtierias of 5th generation fighter that i collected over period of time. Single seat with higher degree of automation.
Extensive use of composities to make it light weight for given volume, so it can sustain supercruise at much higher speeds for long distances, internal weopons to minimize drag, Ultra-Manevourability which will require much complex aerodynaimces. and at the end [b]Ultra sonic missiles to hit targets at greater distance so it assumes it can detect targets at great distance. Now where it is written that Stealth is the most important criteria. it is the byproduct other critierias.
The ultrasonic speed capacity of the missiles will enable the destruction of even remote targets,” Mikhail Pogosyan said.
The controlled traction vector engine of Su-47 will have to be thoroughly modernized. The aerodynamic scheme of Su-47 will undergo fundamental changes as well. Sukhoi’s specialists are currently considering an opportunity to use forward swept wings and the front horizontal empennage for the new plane – small wings in the front part of the hull. Mikhail Pogosyan emphasized that the aerodynamic scheme would not repeat the previously discovered solutions: it will be much more complicated.
The 5th generation fighter jet by Sukhoi will be a single-seated aircraft, in which a pilot will have an opportunity to be in full control of the machine with the help of the high-tech equipment
http://www.royfc.com/news/dec/1207dec02.html
We recall that they had been planning to make a mock-up of the future aircraft a central exhibit of the MAKS-2007 International Aviation and Space Salon, but “they prohibited it for security considerations.” However, the Central Aerohydrodynamic Institute (TsAGI) director, Vladimir Kargopol’tsev, said that the PAK FA project “will be rather strongly marketed.”According to Kargopol’tsev, the new combat airplane will be created taking into consideration the order of “four – five” criteria. The primary requirements are the problems of providing the capabilities for the use of short runways. The fighter’s low-observability factor also has great significance, and also “of what it will carry” – therefore, the aircraft’s ammunitions must be concealed inside the fuselage. The new fighter also will be distinguished by “ultra-maneuverability.”
The provision of supersonic speed in non-afterburning regime also is a “serious feature which distinguishes the fifth generation from the previous.”
But let’s return to the 5th generation of airplanes. As a rule, in the creation of an aviation complex with weapons on average of more than 50 scientific and research institutes participate and more than 1,500 enterprises, and more than 4,000 research and test flight are performed. The 5th generation of airplanes is being created not by a nobody. At the end of the ’80s, the A. Mikoyan OKB, having behind it the MiG-23ML, MiG-21 and MiG-31, designed the principally new article 1.42 (chief designer G. Sedov.) A highly maneuverable fighter with a reclining seat back, which allows in combination with a new anti-G suit enduring loads up to 12 G also was being designed.
Everything in engineering, design, equipment and armaments was original, priority-driven and in some way left England, France, Germany, Sweden and Japan behind. In particular, principally new composite materials were used, an engine with a high specific thrust was designed, and supermaneuverability, flight without afterburner at a cursing speed of more than 2,000 km/hour with the use of the principle of lateral thrust control, and also the elimination of signatures that assured radar invisibility were being put into the aircraft. The new aircraft radar with a phased antenna array according to estimates allowed the detection of aerial targets up to 200 km away and provided simultaneous guidance at various targets of more than 5 missiles. This task practically was resolved on the MiG-31.
again, the EW systems of the US are DIFFERENT than those of Russia, so testing it against flankers tells you nothing
Yes just like Volkswagen is different than GM. but they do the same things in different way.
if it’s so easy to predict from pictures, then why is radar signature still so so classified?
something tells me pictures don’t tell the whole story . . .
pictures do tell the story. like noise, dark spot in clear sky. etc.
like how they predicted the F-14 was a Mach 3 super plane?
Alot of it is disinformation for public consumption.
then there should be an abundance of sources on this magical nano
i’m still waiting for 1 . . .
There is abundance but it is off topic.
it is
it is also good against 2008 radars
Certainly not against Russian radars.
funny, their promo videos for the Su-35 show it firing missiles, not guns
That is for export promotion. Why export real Ruaf tactics with fighters?
exactly, disproving your point that stealth hasn’t advanced in 40 years, which is obviously false
Stealth has advanced but it has advanced at cost to other resources. u have less airframes to buy, so less capability to overhlem airdefence system with PGMs at given point. EW systems are advancing way faster.
the laws of physics don’t change
it doesn’t depend on a particular implementation (as your beloved EW does)
there is a reason x-band was chosen for radar that tracks aerial targets: it works the best
F-35/F-22 stealth ‘defeats’ x-band radar, period
to get around it, you have to switch to different wavelengths which don’t work as well and have significant limitations or you have to use multiple transmitters/receivers, which again has its own difficulties
Not the MIG-31 radar that is specifcally against 5th generation Stealth targets period.
it weighs less and has less thrust than a flanker, so again, wtf are you talking about
It cannot lift fuela and weopons like Flanker nor it has the altitude and speed of Flanker to deliver the weopons.
but it does have stealth, and no matter how much you massage it, no flanker will ever have it
Su-34 does not have Stealth shape but it is completely immune from Missiles.
again assuming they ever get close enough to launch
but wait! didn’t you just say all missiles will be obsolete!?!
if missiles are obsolete and it has to drop bombs directly over the target, what then?
And than all IIR will track the target with guns and ur bombs and fighter are tossed. There is reason for several tons of extensive titanium protection on Su-34.
wrong again
http://www.canada.com/vancouversun/news/story.html?id=65945a64-3c5f-46a1-96f6-ced8e3b4972d
So why they are not signing for it if it is $50m? because it is not. that IDAF deal will give some approximate idea but it is not signed yet.
how much of the F-35 budget was devoted to stealth? do tell . . .
For stealth makes aircraft heavy so u need more powrful engine to move it. so all engine costs are also part of stealth aircraft. not to mention carrying fuel for flight tests. It will take a decade before it is certified with any strike weopons.
i’m really not sure what you’re whining about, the F-22 and F-35 can carry as many weapons as any other 4th gen plane. If the US develops a hypersonic missile, they could carry that. That is a separate issue and is not a limitation of either the F-22 or the F-35
Try to put 2 tons hypersonic weopons internally inside F-22.
JSF consumes less fuel than dual engines fighters, like say the flanker for instance
From where it cames from. Export Su-27SK goes 3530km on 9.4 tons fuel. Su-27SM goes 4000km on 9.4 tons fuel. and Su-35 has extensive Supercruise capabilities and has been developed without spending single dime from budget untill this point.
we’ve already shown that 4th gen are NOT cheaper to procure
4th generation are way cheaper if u JSF quantity into context along with development cost.
and what in the world is your thing about older planes being able to carry longer range munitions than newer planes?
Because u have more money left to invest in weopons rather on platforms.
it makes no sense and is flat out wrong, the F-22 and F-35 could be adapted to carry anything an older plane could
It will carry but it wont be stealth and will have airframe stress. so more expensive to repair.
star49let me recap the conversation for you since you seem confused
you: radars will negate whatever little advantage stealth has
scooter: yet russia/india/china are developing stealth aircraft (which seems to indicate they don’t believe stealth will be obsolete)
you: iskander/smerch/5th gen mobile air defenses are their top priority
me: yet they continue to invest in soon to be obsolete stealth (again indicating that they believe it will be useful well into the future)
you: stealth isn’t required for 5th generation (completely avoiding the point)
me: PAK-FA and J-XX are both designed to be stealthy, thus BOTH THE RUSSIANS AND THE CHINESE BELIEVE STEALTH IS AND WILL BE IMPORTANT
you: more COMPLETELY avoiding the point that BOTH THE RUSSIANS AND THE CHINESE BELIEVE STEALTH IS AND WILL BE IMPORTANT
I havent been follwong Chinese development so i cant comment whether Stealth is important or not. But For Sukhoi has said Stealth is one of criteria among so many for there 5th generation fighter.
lol, because flankers and fullbacks simulate stealthy F-22s and F-35s so well
They are testing EW systems.
but do they have an accurate rcs model of either the F-22 or F-35? their actual radar signatures are classified . . .
Russian have clearly seen F-22. and can accurately predict where its RCS will lie. just like they preidicted so many other things.
woah there partner! now you’re starting to wander off the reservation
nano? really? nano what?
please point me to some references about magical ‘nano’ that will be fielded within the next 20 years
next 20 years? It is next 5 years.
stealth never meant invisible, it meant harder to detect, it meant reduced detection range, it meant less accurate tracking
those still hold true today, no matter how many awards russia hands out
Stealth is good against 1970s radars.
LOLOLOLOL
EW (with magic nano technology) will render ALL missiles obsolete and thus we’ll be back to the days of the Red Baron 😮
i’m sorry, if you really believe that, there is nothing i can do to help you
Sukhoi believes in it.
absolutely false, if you can’t see the difference between the F-117 and the F-22 you’re blind
they’re always advancing the art and the new 2018 bomber is supposed to incorporate long-wave stealth too
I can see the difference. F-22 is much costly project with same one role as single role of F-117. F-117 was not even produced in greater quantites nor was computing and manufacturing technology that advanced in F-117 time. It was much more difficult project to execute.
true the radar signature of the F-35 will probably not change/improve much from this point, BUT it works as it is designed to and works well
to detect it requires new wavelengths that aren’t as effective and big antennas that don’t fit on planes or missiles
So it works against one kind of system does not mean it can work against some one else systems. Just looks at high tech manufacturers of semiconductors from Japan/Korea/Germany. there is difference.
because the F-22 is so aerodynamically compromised :rolleyes:
limited amount of fuel? are you kidding me? the F-35 has the highest fuel fraction of any modern fighter
F-35 needs all the fuel because of its weight and stronger engine.
limited weapons? the F-35 can carry as much as an A-10. obviously not in stealth mode, but it gives you FLEXIBILITY
if stealth is important, the F-35 can carry 8 SDBs
if stealth is important, it doesn’t matter how much the Flanker carries because it never makes it to the target
Without Stealth there is nothing special about F-35 that any other 4th generaton fighter cannot upgraded. Flanker can be upgraded with airlaunched Klubir/Brahmos and Strike mission will still be cheaper than overall cost of maintaining and buying F-35.
stealth does require more maintenance, but there have been dramatic improvements in making it easier. The difference between the B-2 and the F-35 is night and way
So does the cost of building F-35. It is still way more than legacy fighters.
right, so we just eliminate stealth and suddenly all projects will be on time and on budget and will run on unicorn farts, just like the FCS, C5-M, LCS and practically every other military project that doesn’t involve stealth
Stealth make the project alot more expensive to beging with and increases multiply with production cuts.
oh wait . . .
stealth is NOT what’s delaying the F-35 program. the engine didn’t like hover mode, DAS hasn’t been finished yet, there are still millions of lines of software to write and integration issues to test, the thermal management in hover mode is challenging
stealth doesn’t even rate a mention at this point of issues causing problems
As i said once u create shell of 5th generation there is little change u can do about it in overall context while Avionics and software is constant improvment so it never finishes.
that is not an inherent limitation of the F-22, it’s just an integration issue
they have other planes to do ASW work so it makes sense to focus the F-22 more on what it does best: A2A combat
if the need arose, rest assured they could hang a couple harpoons or JSMs from it
that said, a couple 1000lb JDAMs could ruin any ship’s day
Provided those limited quantities of weopons can saturate Ship defences and have kinetic energy to do so. There is reason for going towards hypersonics.
surely we can and we will, we’ve been doing it for 200+ years, no reason to change now 😉
Past 200 years World went through World wars/revolutions that shifted alot of people and capital from other continents to another.
um, whatever the price of fuel is, the JSF will be more efficient than it’s contemporaries who will have to carry draggy external tanks everywhere they go
JSF consumes more fuel as it is heavy for single engine fighter. 4th generation fighters are cheaper to procure and can carry longer range weopons so no need for the same mission profile.
star49Our specialists 😎
That numbers do give just an idea about the size of an economy, but it does say nothing about the level of living-standard and more important of the level of technology and sience. The lower living standard in Russia f.e. does allow it to keep a higher number of armed forces compared to France or the other way around France has a higher flexibility to adapt itself to rising living costs related to rising prices for energy f.e. 😉
Russia has higher budget surpluses with lower taxes. People have more money to spend. The Auto market in Russia is two times the size of France despite lower bank loans.
Russia like China can do large infrastructure projects like building complete cities/building new ports/transport routes that will change the World.
France has no flexibility to adopt to global challenges thats why leadership has low approval rating but Russia has higher even going to war and unfriendly investor policies because it can afford to do so.
star49um no, it’s because both PAK-FA (russia and india) and J-XX (china) are designed to be stealthy
look them up sometime
I havent read anywhere that PAK-FA is 5th generation because of Stealth. It is one of the several criterias.
use some critical thought
there’s a reason those frequencies aren’t normally used, it’s because they don’t work as well
also, did you see the size of that antenna? it doesn’t fit on a Flanker
it also doesn’t fit on an AAM
also, how many stealth planes has it detected? i’m going to go with zero at the moment
manufacturer claims are nice, let’s see how they match reality
you assume they can get within 100km without being shot out of the sky
It can assumed that Russian tests Flankers and Fullbacks against there own airdefence system. and u dont need actual stealth plane to test radar technologies. any RCS models can do the job
again, long-range missiles are no substitute for stealth
if you can’t see your stealthy opponent, you can’t target him no matter how far your missiles go
I think that Nano technology revolution have passed on way side of you.
Thats ur assumption that Stealth cannot be seen. One Russian designer got state prize for developing radar for detecting Stealth and that was a decade ago.
EW is good, it is a nice complement to stealth, however it is NOT a replacement for stealth
When EW suites based on nano technologies make missiles obsolet than u have to come to gun fight there hypermanevorablity with massive acceleration comes into play.
you seem to think that it’s ‘obvious’ stealth will be compromised but have utmost confidence in EW to always get your big-ass plane through the tightest IADS.
yeah right . . . .
Because Stealth design is fixed for 4 decades. U cannot do much more with already built plane. EW/Radars are continous upgrades year after year provided the right funding.
so the effectiveness of a fighter is determined by its volume?
i guess the F/A-380 should be best fighter EVAR :diablo:
Its relative term. Steatlh planes are heavy, can carry limited amount of fuel and weopons for its size, price and maintainability is way higher. aerodynamic compromises are another things.
wow a defense project went overbudget, first time that’s ever happened :rolleyes:
We are living in different times. World has changed. U cannot do what same what was ok in past.
i’m still waiting for how the inclusion of stealth caused ‘too many compromises’ for the F-22
I guess u cannot see the limited role of F-22. u cannot sink a ship with the amount of weopons F-22 carry nor it can do ASW job.
one of Criteria of PAK-FA is multirole for all roles.
again, it won’t be the first military project to be over budget and behind schedule, and it won’t be the last
Surely u can continue on this path.
pray tell how the F-35 will be obsolete when it enters service?
When Stealth become obsolete than whats the point of high price of JSF with massive amount of fuel. Can u predict fuel prices in 2015?
1. the CVFs are not small
2. so you’re saying they should cancel the CVFs? well that’s a completely different topic . . .
We are living in 21st Century. Where there is massive improvement in Airdefence/Antiship/Space based technologies. U need aircraft carrier of 300 to 400 aircraft to fight first rate power not some thing based on past.
star49and yet they continue to develop stealth planes, interesting that
Thats ur assumption they only stealth is definition of 5th generation.
bold prediction
completely wrong, but bold nonetheless 😉
Prdouct is based on what i read.
you can only hit what you can see
for ground targets that means only fixed targets
Su-35 has capbility to hit mobile targets at more than 100km. they have introduced super SAR mode even in PESA.
for airborne targets, that means you’re worthless against all but the biggest most visible targets (awacs)
Thats agian ur assumtion. There alot of targets in air from Missiles to UAV that new AAMs are able to takle.
what good is extended range if you get shot down before you even get close to your target?
And extensive EW pods. Why to u think Su-35 has wing tip pods in addition to internal one. It is called flexibility.
such as? please explain the compromises of the F-22 with respect to other fighters
Compare to size of aircraft interms of volume and the quantity of weopons that it carry and cost of whole programe. It was luck that it was developed in low inflation environment of 1990s. This whole JSF is based on unrealistic cost assumption and capability delivery intimeline that make it obsolete any way.
http://www.canberratimes.com.au/news/local/news/general/joint-strike-fighter-boss-on-mission-to-canberra/1331047.aspx
A Finance Department source familiar with the JSF project told The Canberra Times this week that financial risks were now the biggest cloud hanging over the proposed acquisition.”Defence hasn’t left Fitzgibbon and the Government with much choice other than to buy the JSF, it was always pretty much a fait accompli”, the official said.
”The real issue is going to be how many do we buy and over what time period with things looking the way they are, Defence might not get all the capability they want.
”They might have to squeeze a lot more value out of those Super Hornets.”
and if they don’t get the JSF they won’t have anything to put on their shiny new CVFs besides some helicopters and will be unable to mount expeditionary warfare
It wont make a difference what ever they put on Carrier as they cannot fight first rate power with those small carriers.
star49Sorry, the experts don’t seem to agree with your assessment! With Russia/India and China following the US with 5th Generation Stealthy Designs of there own………..
I dont know about China/India but Russian planning includes Strategic weopons top priority. And missiles like Iskander and further development of Smerch system. 5th generation mobile airdefence systems. Upgrade of current fighters. This all are negating value of Stealth fighter as sole source of funding. And with current pace of advancement in Radars there wont be any difference between 4th and 5th generation fighters. as 4th generation airframes can take longer range weopons externally. u can put 3000L ET on 4th generation fighters for extended range. Stealth fighters make to many compromises. British Navy if spends such amounts on JSF. it will starve of funding of everything else for decades to come. and will unable to mount even expeditionary warfare.
Strategic nuclear upgrading remains a priority aspect of army modernization, the general said, “The strategic nuclear forces, as I said, are the most important component. They were, are and will remain the guarantor of national security for the near future. As long as we are a nuclear power no hot heads will venture to attack our country, I think. Therefore, the development of the strategic nuclear forces has top priority,” Popovkin said.
The air force, in terms of the development of strategic nuclear forces, will upgrade their Tupolev Tu-160 planes, he said. Other priorities are the development of a fifth-generation fighter jet and modernization of the Sukhoi Su-24, Su-25 and Su-27 attack planes and the purchase of new planes, including Su-34’s, he said
There is no need to invent anything new. We must create, test and adopt for service all samples of weapons and military hardware that are being developed in accordance with a plan. This refers to the strategic nuclear forces and to the general forces, including aviation, the navy, space armaments, communications systems, automated control systems and means of radio electronic warfare,” he said.
Here, priority will be given to such components as precision weaponry (Iskander short-range missile system and precision weapons being developed on the basis of multiple launch missile systems), the general said
star49As I said they are big lumbering juicy radar targets. Upgrading these legacy aircraft, they still will be big juicy radar targets.
It seems as if you are telling me that the next 10 year upgrades will give you the supernatural ability to predict the future; thusly preemptively destroy the F-22s on the ground.
If you have the ability to predict the future and are obsessed with long-range weapons, then there is no need for legacy aircraftl just use ICBMs.
Billistic missiles are the key. And it will continue to take greater amount of budget resources. And from 2010 Test will become almost double. The second biggest amount of money is going to be space based survellence. so whole earth is constantly monitored. and third is building lots of submarines patrol with more mutlipurpose cruise and billistic missiles. so they are prepositioned for any conflict.
so there is alot of other areas to spend money.
Yes they do, you never heard of in-flight refueling? Do you think we sent the B-2 to Iraq on a carrier? Do you think that the F-22 was created up and shipped to Japan on a boat or on a train? :rolleyes:
Compare Irak/Japan to dominant foe?
It sounds like you want us to keep flying legacy aircraft so your legacy aircraft have a chance to keep up.
With slow speed of induction of Stealth aircraft. other sensors like Radars and 5th generation SAMs will negate what ever little advantage Stealth aircraft have.
star49If, Russia believed that Stealth was so easy to counter. Why spend Billions on the PAK-FA???? Also, why are so many countries holding off on replacing there fighters and waiting on the F-35??? Sorry, that arguement just isn’t cutting it………..
First ur mistaken that Russia is building PAK-FA soley because of Stealth
There alot of other reasons. building fighter with composite materials, retention of industrial skill, applying new aerodynamic concepts, Supercruise with extended flight range not limited supercruise and any way in next 10 to 20 years. they will start replacing current fighter. Most countries will turned off when they know the real price of F-35.
star49Yeah but those are great big fat lumbering radar targets, with absurdly powerful and inefficient radar that screams here I am I’m vulnerable come and get me.
These are big aircrafts and with next 10 year upgrades. they will be sufficiently capable of finding stealth aircrafts by own not to mention advancment in datalinks/IRST/EW etc. And u can potentially put longer range faster strike weopons on Flankers/Foxhound that can prempitevely destroy the airbases at much longer distance from where Stealth aircraft coming from. Stealth aircrafts dont have intercontinental range. they have to be based at limited number of potential airbases and with Russian implementation of doctrine of permanent readiness any such threat will be premptively destroyed with advance adoption of IRBM/Cruise missiles. The key is here to spend budget money on existing platforms as they give more flexiblity, can quickly be upgraded, piliot and maintaince are already trained on them. ur looking at year 2020 before first operational wing of F-35 can proper function all the air to ground functionality. that is too long time for tieing up so much investment in single project whose only defence is Stealth which is becoming dubious with passage of time.
star49I don’t doubt that certain performance aspects are downgraded, but I find it hard to believe that every single piece of equipment, and all of their components are all downgraded. Or that by reverse logic that one can assume that there are automatically huge performance increases of all pieces of equipment that are for Russian use. In other words, perhaps a sensitive system is detuned 5, 10, 20 percent, but I seriously doubt that the Russian equipment is 100 percent(or more) better in terms of kinematics, detection, etc.. This isn’t the Cold War and Warsaw Pact/Soviet client states countries. This is-if you’ve got money, we’ve got weapons time.
thrust, fuel capacity, aerodynamics profile, seeker range all contributed to downgrade export performance. 200KM Kh-31PMK is now for export. Russian version is much more than that. slight difference in size make the range almost double. so slight modification to existing R-77 making its range doubling is not a big deal. and 4 times increase is for next version.
Russia’s Tactical Missiles Corporation (TMC) displayed three new air-to-surface missile (ASM) designs at the Moscow Air Show (MAKS) in late August. The weapons were kept, quite literally, under wraps – covered by tarpaulins – until they had been reviewed by President Putin on the opening day of the show. The three missiles included enhanced versions of the Kh-31 (AS-17 ‘Krypton’) and Kh-58 (AS-11 ‘Kilter’), along with the never-before-seen Kh-38 advanced modular ASM.
The new Kh-31 variant, known as Kh-31AD (the suffix is assessed to be Activnaya Dalnost: active, range), is an extended-range version of Zvezda-Strela’s active-radar guided Kh-31A anti-ship missile. The AD is longer than the 4.7 m Kh-31A. A ‘plug’ added to its mid-section and a lengthened rear motor housing extends the Kh-31AD to more than 5 m in length. The Kh-31AD is understood to be fitted with the same Leninetz-designed U-505 radar seeker as the Kh-31A.
No technical details were provided for the Kh-31AD, but the missile and its performance are believed to be very similar to the Kh-31PMK version revealed by Jane’s in April 2006. Effective range is assessed at around 200 km.
star49The F-35 is perfectly capable of carrying more than 4 AAMs, but UNLIKE the “competition”, it CAN carry 4 AAMs (eventually 6) plus up to 18,300 lbs of fuel internally & FIGHT in a ‘clean’ condition.
6AAM is pretty much clean condition for Su-35/Su-27SM/MIG-31BM.
star49Why do you post articles, and then when they don’t support your claims resort to “well these are for export, not RuAF?” Did those articles say that those were export specs, as I didn’t see that mentioned? Are you telling me that the R77/37s of 2008 have 400 percent more range than those from 2006? So is the R-37 up to 2400km in range now?:eek::D:rolleyes:
Export product shows progress of Industry. since US is not allowing export of F-22 but Russia will create Twin engine, long range, supercruise, Super manevorable, multirole export 5th generation fighter. It shows alot confidence. Similar is the case of Su-35. 400KM range radar for export. Russian officials always remind that export products performance is down graded. Iskaner-M has different range, stealth characteristics, end game manevourability and seeker with real time communication from satellites and UAVs.
I only mentioned that under poject 810 Vympel is creating longer range followup of R-37M. Simlar is project 610. etc. Russia always retains combat edge in sensore, weopons, EW etc. Kh-31PM and Kh-31PMK ring the bell.
star49I don´t think there will be a South American Union. I think the countries there have either started allies between 1-2-3 nations, are under the influence of one of the four super powers or are totally independent like Brazil will be. How ever, that part of the world is not that interesting for the rest of the world. There may be some border clashes as there has always been , but nothing serious. The only thing that might cause concern is “Falkland-like” clashes. For instance, Venezuela against Netherlands Antilles or French Guyana and such…
Brazil may be a regional superpower against its neighbors, but nothing else. No other super power would like to mess with them, there would be nothing to earn. And Brazil could never have a power projection. So they will play on the home field.The reunited Korea and Japan will still be allied to USA. So will Taiwan, and China will not attack any of those countries. There is just much more they risk to loose then to gain. And by 2030 Japan/Korea and Taiwan will still be formidable military powers. China would never hazard their business suffering by going into war with such countries they risk loosing 100.000 lives…
Ukraine will be in EU.
Iran and Syria will be in a very shaky “mid-east allied treaty” (along with other mideast countries ) where everybody distrust and hates each other but is kept together by Israel and the fact that USA still has “control” over Saudi Arabia, UAE, Qatar, Kuwait. Iraq will either be divided between a small northern sunni and a major shiite or totally annexed with Iran (Perhaps Turkey, Syria and Saudi has taken there small parts). Iraq may be a Poland in the 30´s between Hitler and Stalin but with a few more players involved.
North Africa I think is going to somehow incorporated with that “mid-east allied treaty”. Only because they are muslims, have oil and cause of internal stress. They will need an outside enemy to blame, everyone who is not into islam that is….Russia… As I said, like it is today. Today it is aggressive and trying to incorporate the former Soviet states into the republic. This will continue, and they will probably have some allies in Africa and a couple in South America. India will not be one of them tough. India will try to be independent but will essentially be in the same position as today, but more of an ally to USA (I know the Indians on this board would hate that thought)
Africa will still be the black sheep. In the next 20 years they will not evolve, they will devolve. They will go back to 17th century age (or today almost) where companies really had the power of the countries but let the strongest tribes believe they were. By offering small payments in form of alcohol, drugs and weapons so they can serve their masters. The rest of the world will suck this continents resources dry and they will keep killing each other in tribal wars, just like it have been done in the last 400 years or so.
Australia and New Zealand… They will be exactly as they are today.
The first major conflict I think will be between China and Vietnam. Ok, tough odds, but they are still neighboring countries and the death toll could climb well over 10.000.
The other one I think is between Israel and Jordan. Such a conflict would off course also spark Syria and Iran to join. And probably the whole of northern Africa and the remains of Iraq. This could very well be the 2nd nuclear war in the world depending on how successful the Arab league are in the initial days. The rest of world would not intervene in fear of nuclear attacks. This could very well mean the end of the Zionist nation, but probably not by looking at previous wars. But it would certainly be more bloody.. This war will go to the history books as “The most idiotic reason to start a war”, Israel stole Jordans water supply…
Ur again making wrong predictions. Japan is already under mountain of debt with no net immigration or birth rate increase. In 2030 its economy will completely collapse as it will have no natural resources to export and all manufacturing shifted to other East Asian countries. NK will not Join SK unless SK becomes completely neutral. NK can become alot more powerful once all the trade routes are opened.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/10/09/AR2008100901229_2.html?sid=ST2008101000869&s_pos=
Unlike in neighboring Japan, Korea’s exports are still booming, up 28 percent this year, with 50 percent growth to Russia, South America and the Middle East, according to the finance ministry
And South Korea, unlike Japan, is well-positioned to grow in spite of an expected drop in U.S. consumer spending. Only about 10 percent of Korean exports are sold to the United States, with the bulk going to China, the Middle East and other emerging markets.
“The dollar problem in Korea came from outside,” said Kang, referring to U.S. banks that stopped making dollars available to South Korea as the credit crunch worsened stateside. “We are ready and willing to manage this problem.”
Irak/Iran/Syria/lebnan/Behrain and part of Saudi arabia will be under new ****e system. Whole of Central Asia will be under Russian dominant sytem of pipelines and transport routes with huge market for immigrants as the gap in wages widens with similar languages. EU will be in futher debt with very little military power left to influence anything even in North Africa. Unless EU/US change its financial sytem of subsidizing allies through export markets they are headed for collapase just like Soviet Union but key difference is Russians stopped believing in the system since late 70s when funding was cuttoff but EU/US continue to prop up the bankrupt system which will lead to further collapses in future.
star49I’ve seen a wide varation of figures for the Flanker’s(SU-30/35) range, which is why I brought it up. Some as low as 3600km, some saying 4000, some saying 4000 with 2 external tanks. The combat radius figures were more stable at around 1500km.
Let me clarify the flanker as there difference due to weights and twin seat drag.
Su-30MK2=9750Kg fuel=3000Km range.(AL-31F).
Su-27SK=9400Kg fuel=3530km (AL-31F)
Su-27SM=9400Kg fuel=4000Km (AL-31FM-1 engines/lighter avionics/FBW)
Su-35=11,500kg fuel=4500km range according Pilot estimation. (117S engine)
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