Dave HomewoodI agree – am poised to post in a rage when Tom Cruise is cast as Guy Gibson:diablo: Harrison Ford as Barnes Wallis:diablo:….Mat Damon as “dingy young”
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Some reports have said that James McEvoy will be Gibson, and Sir Ian McKellan as Wallis. Whether it’s accurate is anyone’s guess.
Dave HomewoodI had never heard of the Channel Dash Swordfishes, but I had heard of the 100 Squadron losses as I interviewed George Gudsell who was on the squadron in the Beaufort Flight, and he lost a lot of mates that day, and nearly himself in the raids.
It’s nice to know that there are several Swordfish around commemorating the bravery of those who flew it, especially the flyers. It’s a great shame the Vildebeest and Vincent is so poorly represented. Their crews also put a lot on the line, some of them even in NZ skies lost their lives on operational patrols. All of them would have done their best if they’d found enemy subs or shipping, which were in our waters at that time.
There could be a great documentary with CGI special affects about those who flew into combat in obsolete or ineffective aircraft – Swordfish, Vildebeests, Battles, Defiants and all the other poor performers.
Did those Vildebeest units in Africa ever come up against enemy action of any sort?
Dave HomewoodAnother option that would work well Moggy is a bomber crew who get shot down and have to evade capture, a modern day One of our Aircraft is Missing. There are plenty of true stories to draw from, many of them fighter pilots rather than bombers of course but there would be more dynmaics on screen with a crew in terms of dialogue in English, etc.
Dave HomewoodI will keep my faith in the attention to detail and fresh approach that is normally shown in their work by those that work for Wingnut Films and Weta Workshops, amd in the scriptwriter Stephen Fry and others involved like Frost and Jackson and Rivers, all intelligent and respectd men, and reserve judgment till I’ve seen the film.
Dave Homewoodin the arts, copying and remaking varies in regard between being thought of as outright theft and a stunning lack of originality.
You must be joking. By that logic then you’d not have any theatre companies putting on Shakespeare plays because you consider it theft from the orginal company that first staged it, or you’d never allow symphonie orchestras to play Beethoven again because someone else has played it before? Tosh.
If Jackson and co are making a film about the same events, then why not call it something other than The Dam Busters??
They have renamed it, all the references to the new film have it as Dambusters, not The Dam Busters.
I would also see new stories being made into films, there are so many amazing war stories out there. But I have no problem with remakes at the same time. A remake is NOT a crime. How is it any different from writing a new book on a subject previously covered by someone else in print? It’s a new interpretation using more modern methods and ways of thinking around the subject. I’m sure there are more than one book out there on Spitfires or Hurricanes (or Lysanders?) but people still buy the new ones that tell the same story.
Dave HomewoodJackson’s a great technical film-maker, and I’m very appreciative of his Great War efforts, but he’s going backwards with his gutless choice of remakes, IMHO. He’s not going to get listed as a great director in history going this route.
Jackson has only remade one film, King Kong, and it was a far better effort then the two previous efforts for a million reasons. All his other films have been original creations or first time filmic adaptations of popular books.
Once again, it is Christian Rivers making Dambusters, Jackson is just an investor, like Sir David Frost who started the project and others.
Dave HomewoodWell I for one am not looking forward to it. I read somewhere that they were planning to change the name of Gibson’s dog, ‘Nigger’, or omitting it entirely to avoid offending modern sensibilities.
If they change details like that, no matter how small, it’s no longer history. If you’re simply going for ratings, why not swap the Lancs for Eurofighters?
Do it right or don’t do it at all, that’s my view. Anything less would be a disservice not only to 617 Squadron but Bomber Command as a whole.
Apologies for the rant, but I’m touchy about things like this.
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Each to their own but I find your attitude rather bizarre. All history films, even documentaries, have to omit details or change history slightly. The original Dam Busters film is full of errors too, do you refuse to watch that one?
And as far as the use of the dog’s name goes, was what you read an official statement from the makers or just conjecture on a forum?
Dave HomewoodInteresting stuff James. Are you sure the flight of aircraft that were decimated when trying to attack the Japanese fleet wasn’t Vildebeest? There was certainly an RAF squadron that lost all their Vildes, whilst their poorly assembled Beauforts remained grounded through maintenance issues and couldn’t support the Vildebeest flight. The Beauforts eventulally escaped to Australia.
The entire Channel Dash operation was something of a shambles, the RAF had literally hundreds of aircraft (was it over 1000 from memory?) over the Channel hunting the fleet and not one of them got near the German ships, which shows what an amazing defense the ships must have had. Though 485 (NZ) Squadron lead by Bill Wells did sink an E Boat and shoot up some others.
Dave HomewoodIt must be remembered that the director of The Dambusters is Christian Rivers, not Peter Jackson.
Dave HomewoodIt is interesting that the Vildebeests and Vincents that came to New Zealand formed our front line of defence from 1935-1941 along with the similar Baffin. The V-bombers were in fact used as advanced trainers (before the Harvards arrived), reconnaissance bombers, transports, army co-op aircarft, navy co-op aircraft, target towers, air ambulances, aerial survey and photographic platforms and much more. They were a versatile and capale aircraft and the aircrews loved them, apart from the noise. They reckon flying them was like flying a big Tiger Moth. So they werecertainly versatile.
When the RNZAF was gearing up for its first torpedo squadron in 1943 the media speculated that they’d be sold Swordfish for the role, but instead NZ was allocated Avengers, so they were happy. Although the RNZAF flew Vildebeest, Vincents and Baffins they never had torpedo gear as the gear was too expensive to purchase.
For the record the name Vildebeeste seems to be an acepted RNZAF spelling which crops up commonly in documents from the time, but I prefer to use the factory-given name.
Dave HomewoodWhy not remake it? It’s a truly classic story that is familiar to many people, and the original version is now so outdated it will simply fade from the minds of the public because the younger generation won’t relate to it. Amodern coloured version with hopefully a more accurate storyline will be most welcome. My only concern is I doubt anyone could better Michael Redgrave’s performance as Barnes Wallis.
Dave HomewoodInteresting stuff. I guess this all ties in with something I noticed a long time ago. The NZ Amry’s infantry cap badges during the war carried the motto ONWARD whereas today the same badge has DEFENCE in its place.
We have a Ministry of Defence – I wonder, and will try to find out, if it was originally a War Office instead. I’m surprised it hasn’t changed to Ministry of Peacekeeping and Pacifism. I’m all for peace and the good wor our military does in the world but I don’t think theyre much of a ‘defence’ any more.
Dave HomewoodRegarding Crete you’re probably right that the Allies wouldn’t have had much hope. If you want two great books to read seek out Kiwi At Large and A Kiwi Vagabond by Errol ‘Bill’ Allison. It’s a stunning book, he fought at Crete and in North Africa and in greece, and was captured in Africa, and was a POW till the end of the war. When he came home to NZ he was psychologically screwed – this is not dwelled on in the book, but I have spoken with him personally and he told me his life was dreadful, his marriage fell apart and he hated his old job as a teacher, so he decided in about 1954 there was one thing for it. He sold up everything and with just 50 pounds he set off from NZ and walked all the way back to Europe. The book is about his journey and most especially about his revisiting the battlegorunds. He ended up meeting a girl in Crete and lived with them for some months, and he explored all the places where he’d fought, slept, ate, saw mates die, etc, and wrote his feelings down. It’s a fantastically well written book, and very detailed and touching. Anyway, one point I wanted to make was when he visited the graveyards in Crete in the 1950’s he said all the Allied graves were perfectly well kept but he was shocked to find the German cemetary had, after the war, been smashed to pieces by the locals, ploughed over and allowed to become all overgrown, It’s very understandable but i wonder what the situation is nowadays, has the German Government restored their cemetery I wonder or are their boys lying in unmarked graves under rubble and scrub?
I can’t recall off handwhich book came first but the first one was his journey to Engalnd via all the battlefields ad prison camps (he even sought out the Italian prison guards who mistreated him and visitied them in the 1950’s to see how they were, and he blagged his way into Communist Poland to visit his old camp, which was very tense too). And the second book was written a few years later when he’d had enough of the UK and walked home to NZ again.A remarkable man.
A final note, in the 1950’s when he got to France he ran into an older kiwi couple and it transpired the old man had been in the First World War and was also on a pilgrimage to his own battle sites, with his wife. Bill accompanied them to a French cemetery where the old digger was looking up old mates, it must have been amazing these two generations of old soldiers on their journey back to the horrors of their past to sort their emotions out properly.
Sorry for the aside, back to the thread topic….
Dave HomewoodI knew about the Poles securing the first Enigma machine, an incredible story of courage behind that from memory.
There’s never been much intelligence behind the war with Al Queda but that’s another story.
The biggest problem for Tiny Freyberg on Crete was getting shot. When he was carted off to the aid station his four subordinates all decided to take his place and each began running the battle differently, causing too much confusion. But yes, they snatched a terrible defeat from the jaws of what technically should have been a victory. The German paratroops were initially like rats in a trap.
The taranto raid is mentioned by both sides in Tora, Tora, Tora, as is the details of the toprdoes bottoming out and needing modification. I’m wondering, has there ever been a film about the Taranto raid though? I don’t know much about it but I know enough to judge it would make a great film.
Dave HomewoodThe level of detail that was put into created replicas of the two Helldivers in King Kong plus of course his other aircraft show that Peter Jackson is certainly keen to make the film prop aircraft look right, but I certainly cannot see why Weta or Wingnut would attempt to build a full sized flying Wellington just for a film in which it might be seen in one scene during the bomb testing phases. The film budget would surely never stretch to the creation or restoration of a flying bomber of either sort, Wellington or Lancaster I would think. The eight reported fibreglass Lancasters must have cost a sizeable chunk of the budget as it was. And when you have the best special effects guys working for you, whu bother with the real thing.
One other point, if anyone was attempting to build a full sized flying Wellington, there is probably no way that it would be kept a secret as so many different workshops and areas of the aviation industry would be needed to support such a build or rebuild. So, if it is happening, where, how and why?
I’d love to be proven wrong. It would be nice to see a Wellington replica in NZ to commemorate the thousands of kiwis who flew them in Bomber Command and Coastal Command, as well as the Desert Air Force.
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