The 617 Sqn ( Dambusters) Lancaster still sitting in a swampy field in Sweden and not in a museum

That still bugs me like a really deep itch that I can’t scratch.

I now have a choice of trying to find a replacement or rebuilding the oversized doorstop that is a spare block I have lying about. The prices are horrendous!

Swearing has ensued after the younger brother has just turned up with a rather tidy looking Mk2 Jag (the Morse one, and in red)

Little ****.

Awesome stuff. I’m definitely attending! The ones I’ve been to in the past have always been superb, if cold!

It could be said that the object is to provoke thought rather than being understood?

It does that.

Thoughts include:

When they get bored with them can I have one?
Could I make any of those engines run?
Wouldn’t it be funny to turn them all through 180 degrees one night when no-ones looking…

I’m struggling to get my head around it.

One for the reason that I would love an Anson, but its not something I can achieve right now. Any one of those would be a potential project for someone.

The second being that I find it very strange to collect derelict airframes form the farms and fields over many years… to put them back out into a field, supposedly as art, but with no public access?

Who’s going to see them now?

It didn’t fail within a few miles of fuelling up. It failed barely 500 miles after using Fuelsave unleaded.

Going to and from Coventry for me is a 160 mile round trip, which its done successfully every weekend, since June. I’ve done around 7500 miles in 5 months. I’m kind of anal about using an old car for high mileage, so I’m always checking the state of tune, compression figures mixture and so forth. Its rare, if ever, its off its best.

Two weeks ago, I was out of fuel on both tanks and needed fuel early on a Sunday morning. The only place open was selling fuelsaver unleaded, so I put that in, and headed down the motorway. The car ran awful… no power and a really harsh ‘flat’ engine note as if it were very lean.

I put a tankful of regular unleaded into it as soon as I got chance, and checked it over when I got home. The plugs had sandy deposits on them and there was (and still is) a varnish like residue/deposit on the pistons. Compression figures were still good across the six cylinders (170psi within +/-2psi) and I have the compression figures from each time I do the oil and filter; they haven’t altered much in a year, even after taking it to Le Mans and back.

I took it down the motorway last weekend, and on the way back it started surging, then developed a constant misfire. At motorway speeds you could barely feel it but on pulling off the motorway, it was down one cylinder.

Got home, checked, and no compression on no6. Got the spark plug out, its wet with oil, and on shining a light down inside the cylinder, theres a 2p piece sized hole in the piston crown.

2.8 Jag engines have an unusually short stroke, against the bore size, causing the piston to linger around top dead centre too long. As a result the pistons retain more heat than the bigger 3.4 and 4.2. This was the cause of a spate of engine failures in the 70’s… which was found to be due to carbon deposits (poor fuel, gentle town driving) getting overheated after motorway use and building up to a temperature that would cause the piston to fail.

Jaguar couldn’t replicate it on their test engines, as they were giving them a thrashing. I don’t drive gently… and I KNOW my engine was good. With the hills around here in Derbyshire, you know pretty quickly if its sick.

If that fuel intentionally put a deposit on the piston, then the next harsh use or motorway trip was always doomed to failure.

This nice little snippet of information from Shell’s info leaflets on “Fuelsave” petrol.

“The new unleaded formula contains a lubrication agent that coats the top of the pistons when fuel is injected into the cylinders, reducing friction and thus improving combustion efficiency.”

😡

That’s great… ‘cos the thing that used to eat Jag pistons in the 2.8 engine was deposits on the piston crown. Thanks for not having the information freely available at the pump you bunch of overpaid, price inflating, moneygrabbing meddling swine.

😡

If I had known that you were watering it down with Ethanol and turning proper petrol into some hippy satisfying gnats **** thats barely two stroke fuel I would have pushed all two ton of empty Jag up the six junctions of the M1 solo.

:mad::mad:

As it is I’ve now lost the sweetest little Jag engine I’ve ever had the fortune to own thanks to some retarded Professor Weeto in the Shell fuels lab chucking his lunchtime drinkie into the mix. If I ever meet the guy who came up with the formula, I’m gonna frogmarch him to the nearest pump that sells it and make him drink it.

Fuelsave? Of course. I’m not using ANYTHING now the engines finished digesting itself am I?

ARRRRGGGHHHHHHHH!!!!!

I know the pictures you are talking about but I don’t see any problem. I’ll get into them later on today and will see if I can figure out what Gardiner is on about. There is a slight snag though. According to the H&W list both pictures are of the Olympic. H1515 was taken in April 1911 and H1825 in December 1912. By that time the Titanic was on the bottom of the Atlantic. If Mr. Gardiner had done his homework he would have known. Oh sorry, it’s a conspiracy, isn’t it? So the files must be forged! :diablo: However, if you check to two following photos H1826 and H1827 (Olympic) you will see that the bridge wing cabs haven’t been moved further outboard. This alteration took place on Olympic after the Titanic disaster. So if the ship on the ocean floor is the Olympic, it should have bridge wings that were flush with the surface of the hull, correct?

It is a conspiracy! All we need is a murder an a kidnapping thrown in and we have a full set! (given that it was supposedly Olympic, on fire, and with a broken keel.) Conveniently for the conspiracy theorist types the bridge wings didn’t survive did they? Most of the bridge was wiped out.

You’re being sarcastic. The bell that was found is not the bell people expected to see. Only ONE bell had the name of the ship on it. Apparently they didn’t find that one. Like I said the size of the bell doesn’t match any bell in the rigging plan

Admittedly that was a bit sarcastic, though I wouldn’ really expect anything down there in that area not to come off Titanic. Unless it came from the missing sub, or the mystery ship which she supposedly collided with (The mor I read Mr Gardiners book, the more I think it has more paralllels with Clive Cusslers novels than reality)

The White Swan Hotel has the First Class Lounge and parts of the Grand Staircase. Whenever you’re in that area check it out, the lounge is huge and very impressive.

I’ve put it on my ever growing to do list! A couple of friends suggested I go have a look a while back.

They are! You’ve never seen the film have you? Send me your address via pm and I’ll see if I can get a copy out to you. Gimmi a few weeks though.

Peter

To be honest, it was ages ago when I watched it. No need to go copying it, its on the internet. I’ll have a look again. (Just to check.. I am right in thinking it’s the one with Telly Savalas hosting it, yes??)

I think I’m going to leave this discussion here anyway, as I’m sick of Mr Gardiners book now, and his arguments get weirder and weaker throughout the book. I’ve chucked it in the recycle pile and dug out my copy of Dr Ballards “Discovery of the Titanic”, as it’s a better read.

Just a question as you’re obviously into Titanic in a big way, did they ever find out what happened to the first memorial plaque Dr Ballard laid? Someone told me he had to put another down on his last trip as the original had gone.

Regards,

Ric