hopsalotMore good news for the F-35, prices continue to steadily fall (down 4% in LRIP-6 and 8% in LRIP-7 compared to LRIP-5 prices) and the US will be free to buy the full planned buys for the next two years.
Lockheed Martin Corp (LMT.N) and the Pentagon on Tuesday said they reached an agreement for 71 more F-35 fighter jets, with lower pricing allowing the U.S. government to buy all the planes it had planned despite budget cuts that took effect in March.
The agreement, which was first reported by Reuters on Monday, covers 36 jets in a sixth batch, with each warplane to cost about 4 percent less than the previous lot, and 35 planes in a seventh batch, also at a 4 percent discount, Lockheed and the Pentagon’s F-35 program office said in a statement.
The statement did not provide an overall value for the two contracts, but analysts say they will be worth over $7 billion.
http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/07/30/us-lockheed-fighter-idUSBRE96S14220130730
hopsalot[ATTACH=CONFIG]219218[/ATTACH]
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hopsalotSorry, completely forgot these.. Will update the list.
BTW, wonder if those three Russian AF MiG-29UBTs returned from Algeria do have the NIIP OSA-2 PESA radar installed?
Anyone knows?
Depending on exactly how we are judging things the F-15SA could be on the list. They aren’t operational yet but they are flying and in production obviously.
hopsalotYou chaps never manage to stay on topic do you?
This is totally on topic. The Eurofighter consortium claims the Eurofighter has the world’s most advanced mechanically scanned radar. We are just trying to put together a list of aircraft that have moved on from mechanically scanned radars…
hopsalotDon’t forget the USAF F-15Es have already started their APG-82 upgrade program.
Then there are the announced contracts and near term decisions:
ROK awarded the F-16 upgrade contract to Raytheon’s RACR
Taiwanese F-16s will either be RACR (likely) or SABR.
Many US F-16s will be upgraded to RACR or SABR
Still missing the Mig-31 as well…
hopsalotDo we positively know it outperforms Zhuk-MS, for example? How?
Anyway, I find a claim in style “best M-scan radar in the world” somewhat similar to “best racing car with wooden wheel rims”. Well, that is nice, except there are many cars with steel rims..
Just my 0.02 🙂
It would be interesting to total up the worldwide inventory of fighters with electronically scanned arrays of one type or another.
hopsalotBtw, replacement of alq99 will use GaN electronics…French way?
French way? Really?
GaN has been on everyone’s roadmap for well over a decade. Besides, the Next Generation Jammer is a completely different class of system than Spectra.
I know, btw 7 plants are certfied in europe. Why this tec isnt used on F35?
The same reason(s) it hasn’t been used much of anywhere else yet either… the technology is still very new and expensive. The APG-81 is already the most advanced radar of its type in the world. Expect to see GaN rolled into the F-35 in a future tech refresh.
hopsalotThe ESM of the F-22 is so good about detecting datalinks that it can fire an AMRAAM just on that information.
Not that it will hit anything unless the tomfool meat servo in the target is banging on like some digital Rush Limbaugh, but it can fire it.
That is pretty simplistic. The vast majority of radars in use today are still mechanically scanned and require a significant amount of time, typically no less than the better part of a minute, to build up complete situational awareness. A cued search could be executed almost instantly, but that only works if you know what you are looking for.
See here for an example of an APG-81 performing a search from a cold start: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CRkpFsXz9yk
In this example it takes a little over 10 seconds for the radar to complete its search, but it is important to remember that this level of performance is not possible with a mechanical array. (which is why this promotional video was created in the first place…)
Even if an adversary were being judicious in his use of his radar if he is doing any real searching he will need to keep it on for several tens of seconds each time, and he would need to be going active regularly to maintain situational awareness. This would allow the F-22 with the benefit of its stealth to approach and fire on its target without ever activating its own radar. It is safe to assume that the F-22’s radar could be activated if the enemy went cold before the AMRAAM went active. In that scenario the surprise would be slightly reduced but I doubt it would much matter in terms of the end result. Any pilot that first discovers they are under attack after their opponent’s missile is already in the air would be lucky to escape alive.
hopsalotGuys, the first IRST appeared on US warplanes back in the 50’s.
Another example of the Great Re-Writting of History thought the web I guess ?
This isn’t simply about IRSTs, it is about pairing BVR missiles with IR seekers with an IRST to carry out long-range engagements without the use of a radar at all, which is a fairly recent development.
Missiles like the AIM-9x, ASRAAM, Python-5, etc already have the ability to reach beyond what has traditionally been considered visual range, but none of these are true BVR missiles.
hopsalotI disagree with the AvWeek statement. The comments about the seeker and larger motor may be true, but there are two fundamental differences between ASRAAM and the AIM-9X Block III.
1. ASRAAM was designed with the emphasis of a high-speed dash to allow the target to be engaged as quickly as possible and at the longest range. AIM-9X was designed with the focus on post-launch agility.
2. AIM-9X Block II introduced a datalink to the weapon. ASRAAM has no datalink.
I agree.
ASRAAM is built for speed more than range, as evidenced by its lack of a datalink. This does give ASRAAM increased range performance in many scenarios(such as crossing shots and tail chase shots), but without a datalink it is not a true BVR weapon.
What is being discussed for the AIM-9x Block III is a BVR weapon that presumably retains substantial WVR capabilities. (It will be interesting to see the extent to which the Block III is optimized for BVR. Omitting thrust vectoring for instance could improve BVR performance. If all that is being retained from the AIM-9x Block II is the seeker, datalink, and TDD then the Block III could be a completely different class of weapon. Perhaps the Block II will be retained for WVR and the Block III will be more of an AMRAAM competitor.)
I also don’t get BS’s argument about the US following the UK’s lead. This is also a continuation of a trend that emerged some years ago in the US. The AIM-9x Block II already provides a datalink for BVR shots and the US has been working on an IRST for the Super Hornet for years.
If I were going to give anyone credit for being in the lead it would be the French, not the Brits. Though the latest Rafales lack an IRST earlier models were built with one and unlike the Brits, the French have a proper BVR IR guided missile.
hopsalotApparently, US types(s) were struggling with engine performance at hot & high altitudes but I’m sure these were trials in Kuwait, not Qatar. Should be taken with a pinch of salt either way for obvious reasons. Corrections welcome.
Seems like a less than credible rumor given the long established track record these types have in the region. The F-15SA in particular will be the third distinct variant of that jet sold to the Saudis to date.
hopsalotBecause F15 and F18 evaluation didnt go well maybe?
Seems rather unlikely. These sorts of competitions are not the sort of thing that are going to be swayed by a good or bad day.
hopsalotIs that where the term garbage in, garbage out originates from? :rolleyes:
However, they seem to be pretty spot on with the internal weapons on the Pak FA (8 is demonstrated so far and there is plenty space left)… but even a blind hen sometimes finds a grain of corn.
Well I can’t speak for the input, but the output is certainly garbage.
It is interesting to see their vastly different standards of proof/skepticism depending which program they are examining. They credit an aircraft they couldn’t even name with a whole range of capabilities that even years later haven’t yet been demonstrated… while at the same time inventing weaknesses for the F-35 with no basis whatsoever in reality.
hopsalotHave to agree, making an estimation based on the Viper and Hornet fleets will be relevant but it wont accurately predict the costs for the F-35.
The costs in severall sub systems should be lower for the “35”, i am thinking of the radar (an AESA, the USAF Viper fleet uses MSA´s), the SFC for the engine should be lower than what we find in the F100/F110 and it has its own integrated LDP, on the other hand the stealth bit should add costs.
In the end i think its safe to presume that a 13+ ton stealth strike fighter equiped with the “biggest” engine ever is going to be more expensive to operate than the USAF Viper fleet, by how much? Only time will tell.
A little more on this:
“In many ways, the F-35 is easier to maintain than the F-16,” said Capt. Terje Vik, a maintenance lead from the Royal Norwegian Air Force. Vik has been at the F-35 ITF since the aircraft first arrived May 2010. “The F-35 has fewer LRUs [line replaceable units] and is more software driven. Normal scheduled maintenance is reduced. And the computer interface replaces a lot of test equipment. The aircraft also has more built-in test capability. Overall, fewer people are required to maintain the F-35.”
hopsalotI do wonder how they came to that conclusion considering that they accept that the F22, J-XX and Pak FA will be able to open their bay doors at supersonic speeds.
I would say they used the same methodology that lead them to conclude (in 2009 no less) that the PAK FA would have Mach 2 supercruise and 8-10 internal weapons stations or that both the PAK FA and the “J-12/J-XX” would have “highly integrated avionics” equal with those in the F-22/F-35. (I do love how even before they knew the name of the J-20 they had already concluded that it was at least the equal of the F-22…)
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