hopsalotThere’s more to radar performance than the antenna (new mechanically scanned radars are still being made, & selling), & raw performance isn’t the only factor in deciding which radar to buy.
Indeed, how many total fighter aircraft are operational with AESAs outside the US? Japan’s F-2s, UAE’s F-16s, a couple dozen Rafales, maybe Singapore’s F-15s…
We are only talking about a few hundred total.
hopsalotNavy F-35C Completes Final Carrier Tests
The F-35C really is a cool looking plane.
hopsalotMan, you have to read the editor note…
Ahhhh… Writing a news article or drinking yet another Margarita at the beach bar during summer vacations… What a rather complex choice to make, no?
Really really embarrassing… I mean the fighter was in plain view.
“F-35 not invisible to the naked eye from 50 meters away! Billions in stealth research wasted!!!1one1”
hopsalotNo prob… Have your elite pilots already told you something about the JHMCS on those F-15s they have faced? I am eager to learn more.. 🙂
Is that what you are reduced to now? Each pilot was surveyed about how the F-35 compared to their previous aircraft… why on earth would they ignore a system that has been operational for years and years on the 4th generation fighters?
hopsalotLOL, no prob with that, I would not even dare to think otherwise 🙂 🙂
The little ironic dwarf in me tells me that Mike’s credibility would be vastly higher if he had the “politically proper” opinion about the F-35.. :eagerness:
You can have “Mike Sweet,” the rest of us will rely on the 31 elite pilots surveyed for the recent article.
hopsalotYeah so what ever happened to LO 🙂 got some sort of job offer I hear ? lol
As it turns out his true calling was PR, who would have guessed?…
hopsalotI am still calling it a brick.. It’s a nice name and it fits the thing.. If you account for the really ultra advanced engine technology available, its performance is very mediocre.. “Only” comparable to a loaded F-16 is hardly what I call great considering the post-2025 adversaries..
Oh, so consistently beating an F-15C in WVR is “mediocre.” I guess that means there are a heck of a lot of bricks in the sky these days aren’t there? :highly_amused:
Well, when I see those pictures and slogans SolarWarden has posted, I am not sure whether you guys are entirely complete.. :stupid: Show me any other type where reaching IOC is an occurrence worth posting two pages of “very bad news for the suicidal anti-F-35 crowd”.. Yeah, like no other type has ever reached IOC before.. You seem to treat the thing like a cult, in a very unhealthy way..
Here you were claiming it could barely take off and land…. back in May 2016.
I also love the high scores in the mission effectiveness of the F-35, while the real aircraft can barely take off and land and there is practically no mission it can safely perform..
:highly_amused:
Reality… I am observing that from a broad perspective.. Back in ~2006-7, I have estimated the F-35 to become a “nothing special” fighter with rather mediocre flying abilities, no supercruise, double the price tag of an F-16, double operating cost, delayed, but with solid avionics.. Now, details like “can technically supercruise for 150 miles” or “will cost $50mil in 2040 after twenty millions units produced” aside, the final result is quite similar to what I have imagined back then.. In the end, that is all that matters..
So basically you just set aside all the evidence you don’t like and claim you are correct…
:stupid:
hopsalotI don’t doubt the build quality of the 35, but the overall smoothness has more to do with RAM than anything else.. F-22s are exceptionally smooth, as well.. Much less so when RAM is not applied..
The F-35 doesn’t have the same type of coatings as an F-22. :rolleyes:
Creating a stealth-capable fighter jet requires striking the right balance between stealth, manoeuvrability and affordability. Central to the F-35’s design is the application of composite materials to reduce observability as well as ongoing maintenance costs. A substance called fiber mat has been cured into the composite skin of the aircraft, avoiding the need for the application of stealth coats.
hopsalotCompletely failed logic.. Tejas does not replace the Su-30MKI, it replaces the MiG-21, MiG-27ML and/or Jaguar. How many of Tejas pilots would not take Tejas 100% of the time over the MiG-21 in BVR combat or consistently beat the MiG-21 in WVR combat?
…and the F-35 doesn’t replace the F-15C or F-15E, but that didn’t stop them from including them in the comparison.
If you’ve already dragged the thing that far, I must have missed the story where your overly cheerful F-35 pilots would take the F-35 over an F-22 in both BVR and WVR..
:stupid:
Who said F-35 pilots would take the F-35 over the F-22?
hopsalotBecause contest rigging is completely unheard of in the US of A procurement programs.
Yeah, because anytime someone doesn’t pick a lower performing option that must mean the contest is rigged…
hopsalotHe wasn’t.. But his words were repeated to death and used to set fire upon all those naysayers, heretics, anti-Americans and other lowlifes not bowing down the the great F-35 shrine..
You called the plane a “brick” earlier in this thread. :stupid:
Lets not pretend this is an issue of some kind of a cult. It is an issue of some people here wanting to discuss reality and others wanting to invent it.
This report is perfectly consistent with what the “naysayers” have been saying for years.. that this flying brick will have hard time to match even an F-16, despite the 180 odd kN thrust installed.. and that the “almost F-22 for a price of a Viper” thing claimed by the fanboy brigade ain’t happening.. of course, the fanboys (and Beesley) have silently abandoned this tirade and shifted the goalposts towards an F-16 since then, but my memory is still very good..
:highly_amused:
hopsalot:sleeping: Yaawn.. Your memory is very short and selective.. I will give it one last shot and post the “facts” from the past.. If you now pretend you can’t remember those page-long tirades (mainly in 2009-2010) about how the F-35 almost matches the F-22 because Beesley said so, then I really cannot help you..
Don’t hold your breath..
In terms of aerodynamic performance, the F-35 is an excellent machine, Beesley said. Having previously been only the second man ever to have flown the F-22 Raptor, Beesley became the first pilot ever to fly the F-35 in late 2006. As such, Beesley is intimately familiar with both programs. According to Beesley, the four current test pilots for F-35 have been most impressed by the aircraft’s thrust and acceleration. In the subsonic flight regime, the F-35 very nearly matches the performance of its’ larger, more powerful cousin, the F-22 Raptor, Beesley explained. The “subsonic acceleration is about as good as a clean Block 50 F-16 or a Raptor– which is about as good as you can get.” Beesley said.
The aircraft flies in “large measure like the F-22, but it’s smaller, and stiffer” than the Raptor however, Beesley explained, adding that the aircraft handles superbly. The reason for the similar flight characteristics, explained the test pilot, is because the man who designed the flight control laws for the Raptor, is also the same man who is responsible for the flight control software for the F-35.
What Beesley expects will surprise future F-35 pilots is the jets’ superb low speed handling characteristics and post-stall manoeuvrability. While the F-22 with its thrust vectored controls performs better at the slow speeds and high angle of attack (AOA) flight regime, the F-35 will be able match most of the same high AOA manoeuvres as the Raptor, although it will not be able to do so as quickly as the more powerful jet in some cases. Turning at the higher Gs and higher speed portions of the flight envelope, the F-35 will “almost exactly match a clean Block 50 F-16 and comes very close to the Raptor“, Beesley said.
http://www.livescience.com/3032-fighter-jet-controversial-future-fleet.html
So basically you just ignored all the qualifiers and caveats and just read what you wanted to, huh?
Flies in “large measure like the F-22.”
While the F-22 with its thrust vectored controls performs better at the slow speeds and high angle of attack (AOA) flight regime, the F-35 will be able match most of the same high AOA manoeuvres as the Raptor, although it will not be able to do so as quickly as the more powerful jet in some cases.
etc etc
It didn’t say it performed like an F-22. He said that the F-35 was similar. He said that the F-35 could match most of what an F-22 could do at slow speeds, but wouldn’t be able to do it as quickly without thrust vectoring…
Once again it seems what we have here is a simple reading comprehension issue.
All things considered, including this latest report with F-15/16 pilots raving about the F-35’s slow speed handling, it seems Beesley was right on the money.
hopsalotThat is why i asked again.. cause there is no info on the F-35 Wight and performance.
It says it can do 9G, fine. But that isn’t very helpfull is it?There are several poster claiming it can do 9G with full fuel and weapons.. curious, what is the F-35A corner speed and turn rate here?
Thinking of the lift areal on F-35, and the mass/weight, something tells me the F-35 will bleed off copious amount of energy when at full weight.
You read English, so I will assume you speak it as well:
hopsalotNewer aircrafts are always praised as great by their pilots with superlatives…look at Tejas with IAF…common stuff.
Really? Please send me the link with the Tejas pilots claiming they would take Tejas 100% of the time over the Su-30MKI in BVR combat and consistently beat the Su-30MKI in WVR combat. I must have missed that story.
Honestly I am unconvinced, I need to see it with my own eyes. The F35 looks like a thick short wing sausage as it needs to accommodate fuel and bombs inside its body. It just does not look maneuverable, you cannot have it all, there are compromises to be made. And if it is then soon we will see it but I doubt it. From what I’ve seen it is far behind 4th gen jet during displays…let see of progress are made but for now it was rather poor…Again I need to see it, not reading another report with an agenda. If it is actually maneuverable they should show it !
:stupid:
World’s greatest fighter:
[ATTACH=CONFIG]247399[/ATTACH]
hopsalotWell, that’s amazing.. 🙂 Honestly, your vote poll shows that 100% of users of your current smart cellphone would prefer to use it over a Nokia 3210 or vintage Motorola RAZR and you are selling that as a huge success?
yeah, call me functionally illiterate once again… Gimme a freakin break…
:stupid:
I was being generous with the “functionally” part.
100% of pilots surveyed would take the F-35 for BVR fights. Even in a WVR fight the “flying brick” consistently beats an F-15C…
Actually I kind of like your cell phone analogy. 4th generation fighters are nice Nokias. The F-35 is the latest iPhone.
When it comes to placing phone calls the iPhone wins consistently… in everything else the performance is so far apart it is difficult even to make a comparison.
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