Anyway….back to the history of the Swordfish. Presumably we have to draw a blank?
Hi Andy – sorry about hijacking the thread, but the comments seemed pertinent to the previous post.
I suspect you are right re the permit, as without any documentary proof, a permit could not be issued under the current rules. A P-38 collision site near me has a similar problem, as although the ID of both aircraft is known, there are no Incident reports available and thus no means of proving which one is which! I understand a permit for one was turned down on these grounds a while ago.
However whilst working on my next book, I have been trying to tie up a lot of loose ends and this collision came under scrutiny. A thorough survey of the surface wreckage at both sites, following a stroke of good luck when Rich Allenby spotted some unusual lettering whilst visiting one of the sites. We have now managed to find definite evidence at each site to confirm the ids. One of my co-authors also looked out for any leads on the Glen Callater Swordfish whilst trawling through many records at the PRO and as you say “drew a blank” – For Now! :diablo:
Their most used tactic was to claim all sites were war graves.
Don’t want to start a discussion on the rights and wrongs of that argument – Those of us experienced in this field know the facts of the matter and all those in this category that I have met and spoken to, treat those few sites where this is the case with the respect they deserve.
However there are still those who are trying to perpetuate this myth and use it for their own purposes – the ill-informed and opinionated rants on this “Blog” will no doubt be familiar to a few on here, but this recent offering borders on the offensive 😡 and to those mentioned is probably libellous?
Freckleton disaster
Full details of the Freckleton disaster HERE.
I recall many years ago (not saying how many! ;)) my father was the commanding officer of the NUOTC (think that’s right?) at Newcastle & I used to make a nuisance of myself during school holidays climbing all over their armoured personnel carriers and 25 pounders etc. One day I spotted a fuselage with two cockpits dumped outside one of the workshops – I was told it was a Chipmunk but at that age I was still more interested in armoured vehicles :eek:, though I remember it looked a lot older to me and am sure it was fabric covered over a tublar framework. However I realised it was obviously surplus to requirements so tried my best shot at trying to persuade my Dad that it would make a good garden feature 😀 I failed, but recall that it had come from a local ATC unit who wanted rid of it but didn’t know how to go about disposing of it officially so they had dumped it on my father’s unit – who didn’t want it either. It was there fore a few weeks and then was simply put out with the dustbins and the council waste services came to pick it up 🙁 Wonder how many other ATC toys ended up on the tip?
BTW what does it say about his mental state?
Apparently he strongly resented being put through the ATA pilot training program and felt that he should not be asked to fly single engined types due to his experience of flying heavy bombers.
Regarding the open cockpit. This could have been open due to a buildup of carbon monoxide, or some other ventilating problem (perhaps fuel vapor in the cockpit).
I have never heard about anyone being thrown through the canopy of a P-51. Although there are plenty of things i never heard about….:D
The problem with these old cases is that they remain speculation. If the investigation didn’t find any conclusive cause, then its much harder now after almost 64 years later.
Hi Mondariz
Yes you are quite right – proving anything now is unlikely, but I really am not happy with the report as it lays the blame on the pilot for carrying out unauthorised aerobatics and makes comments about his mental state. The manoeuvres made were hardly spectacular aerobatics and even the report concedes that there was really no one around to see them anyway. The more I looked at the details, the more it reminded me of another incident we investigated a couple of years ago – P-51B Mustang 43-6635 also lost on a routine ferry flight. The aircraft was newly assembled at Speke and was being flown to Warton for further modification, when it suffered a fuel or glycol leak – the pilot, Flight Officer Eugene Stanley Rybaczek, tried to put it down on a satellite landing ground at Knowsley Park. Witnesses saw vapour streaming from the obviously open cockpit and the aircraft made unexpected manoeuvres before it stalled and crashed on the threshold of the runway.
Daz ! 😉
Missis just gave the orders to do the washing up so i chucked the control column in the dishwasher and come out like a new penny, mind you do need to pay for a quality brand of detergent !!!. Shame the prop wont fit in.
That looks better! Detergent must be “Daz”!!! 😀 Really nice find after all – well done – We never did find the gun button for ours, despite some serious searching through over two tons of metal cornflakes.
Hi Ian & Gareth
Thought that prop looked familiar – even if it has less blades than ours! :p Shame about the grip – looks like you have a fossil on your hands! A tad cold for a dig though IMO, but you seem to have so many to fit in! 😮 At least you are managing to complete a few projects though, as all of our seemed to fall by the wayside this year 🙁 Been out today & finally got a consent form signed for one of the Mustangs though 😀
Photo
Hi – Defiant column I would agree, though a few details on the grip don’t quite match – brake cable guide is different & the steel bracket doesnt look right next to it. Also the pivot ball mountings on mine are all solid brass & the one still on this column is not?
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Sorry for poor photo, but I think you will get the idea.
by ‘fire’ – the only bit related that I saw was one of the work lights contacting a synthetic hose sending a cloud of noxious smoke up the shaft.
Caught it on Saturday too – made good TV, but obviously filmed over several weeks if not months, probably hence the continuity errors – like the first tentative foray into the tunnel immediatly after it had been pumped out – with acro props in place and partly concealed halogen flood lights fixed to the walls! Best way is to just enjoy it and not get too envious at not being involved in such digs! 😀 Bet they were a bit miffed at finding that it had not been completed, as these bunkers normally reveal a treasure trove of artefacts – I have seen more than they found on an afternoon’s walk in the Argonne!
Remember finding one of those big pumps several years ago at a road works site near Ypres – the workmen said take it, but the wife said NO! 🙁
That Gun is VERY interesting, It looks like (correct me if I am wrong) a Naval 4″ Deck Gun , from the WW1 Period, These Guns were also used in Coastal defenses in WW2…
Hi Merkle – We were discussing this on our way up to visit a HGW P-38 site this weekend – I’m no expert on heavy ordnance (well except 20mm :D) But 4″ naval gun of WW1 vintage was my conclusion also – think the coastal defense theory sounds pretty plausible too.
Cranes!
Would be nice to see that crane restored
Hi Peter – You want to take a trip to Millom if you like cranes – I believe they are accumulating quite a collection – mainly with a military connection of course!
TT Aircraft digs
Not sure what went wrong with the B-17 dig – I understand another dig took place & significant remains were found sometime after the TT left the site – but I am not qualified to comment – perhaps someone who actually attended could?
We certainly wanted to investigate further contacts we had identified on our TT project, but were not able to do so due to their restrictions & sadly there is little chance of us ever returning to the site – We did find this though! 😀

Full details of the project at: http://web.ukonline.co.uk/lait/site/Time Team.htm For those that have not seen it.
TT
As Alan has said for some reason the series that the A-26 “Bombers in the Marsh” excavation appeared in does not seem to have made it to satellite/cable channels – looking at the regularity they repeat those, perhaps they felt they had enough to keep them going for a few years yet!? 🙁 It has turned up on More4 a few time though 🙂
Re the recent special – I understand that the Vampir farm (also known as Strohgut) complex was found a while ago and there is plenty of information and original photos on this forum
A contact of mine visited the site earlier this year having arrived in the area the week before filming, when they were pumping it out in preparation. There are many of these bunker/tunnel complexes surviving as they fill with water, which preserves them and helps prevent their collapse 😮
Has anyone recorded the time team special on channel 4 about the WW1 bunker? I forgot all about it being on 😡
Damn! Forgot to set the recorder too 😡
I was surprised when I saw the trailer as remember discussing with their producer re another possible WW1 site a while ago – seems they desperately wanted to do a WW1 TT, but their insurance providers were set against it – all those bombs and deep unstable tunnels etc. (we were talking about the Argonne area) Apparently they only got cover for the aircraft digs by agreeing to have EOD babysit :rolleyes: