LokeLatest issue of J-Wings states that the following aircraft meet the specs of the F-X programme:
> A new variant of the F-15.
> The F-18E/F.
> Typhoon.
The non-spec aircraft are the Rafale, F-22 and F-35.
Thanks, this is very interesting.
Do you have any more details? In particular why did the Rafale and F-35 not meet the specs? Are some of the specs known?
I am surprised to learn that SH and Typhoon met specs but not Rafale?
I can imagine (i.e. guess) that F-22 did not meet spec because it is not available on the export market, and F-35 will not meet spec because it will arrive too late.
Why did they not consider Gripen NG? 🙂
Or is one of the requirements two engines?
Lokewell like I said before, unlike Gripen and Rafale, the Super Hornet is a clear and stable #2 choice for both the FAB and politicians, so its a safe #2 choice! so.. how about Tejas for the Sao paolo?
According to the leaks the SH was 2nd choice for the FAB; however I have not seen anywhere that it would be second choice for Lula and Jobim?
Some of their statements seem to be so “anti-US” that I have often wondered why it was allowed in to the competition at all, let alone made it to the short-list?
Perhaps the SH really has a chance and the Brazilian politicians are just expressing themselves in a manner that is difficult for me to interpret? :confused:
LokeMore details on the IOC delay
Only a week ago, Gen. William Fraser, commander of Air Combat Command (which will operate the stealthy single-engine fighter), said he was “re-evaluating” that date. He says the Air Force wants to declare IOC with Block III software. The Marine Corps is willing to go with the less capable Block II software in 2012.
With the restructuring in the Fiscal 2011 budget plan, JSF flight testing will conclude in the fall of 2014, with a test report out most likely the following year.
This shift could signal an unwillingness on the part of the Air Force to declare operational capability before the aircraft and its software are fully tested. Though aircraft are being produced as planned, the software testing is lagging.
When I read the last sentence it seems to me that the productions issues have been resolved!? And that software is now the main issue??
I have always said: F-35 is too complicated. One should have done it more stepwise and started out with a simpler F-35 initially. An F-35 with avionics from e.g. SH would be a formidable fighter compared to current fighters — and it would have had an enormous growth potential.
LokeLokeThe four Typhoons distributed between 16 hardened shelters . . . .
But what if they attack Sunday morning, when all four are outdoor for washing and polishing? 🙂
OK I admit failure, here is another one:
A surprise attacks with fighters; this triggers the Typhoons to get airborn to meet the threat.
Unknown to the Brits, those sneaky Argies have equipped several civilian ships (fishing boats, cargo ships, cruise ships and whatnot) with some nasty russian SAMs; the 4 Typhoons who think they will wipe the floor with the Argentinian fighters are instead lured into a trap, and shot down.
I leave it as an exercise to the reader to finalize this scenario :diablo:
Lokedont you think its good news that production deliveries start this year to the forces ?
heck, the F-35 pilots even get fitted with flight gear, sweet
http://www.fox10tv.com/dpp/news/f-35-pilots-get-fitted-for-flight#
Definitely also some good news inbetween all the doom and gloom 🙂
I cross my fingers and hope that JSF will do much better in terms of progress than e.g. the NH90 and A400M…
LokeSince we are on the subject of intercepting something faster than itself: According to the Royal Norwegian Air Force this is absolutely possible, it is my understanding that the RoNAF will use the F-35 also in an intercept role, intercepting the future SU-35 and PAK FA 🙂
Edit: Just to avoid misunderstandings; I don’t think the F-35 can intercept an hypersonic missile…
LokeYes enough of the politics. Scenario, 30 Argentinean aircraft a mix of A4-AR / Mirage IIIEA approach the Falklands for a sneak attack. Unfortunately , the Brits have been alerted by intelligence, and 1417 flights 4 typhoons take off to engage armed with 8 AMRAAMS and 2 ASRAMMS each + centre line fuel tanks. Flying in wall formation at angels 30 in radar silence the lead typhoon starts to pick up intermittent A4-AR radar transmissions on the DASS indicating the AN/APG-66VE in search mode. The lead typhoons ECR-90`s is activated on to sweep the sky ahead. Immediately multiple hits are detected at low level angels 2. The lead typhoon data links the bogeys via JTIDS link to the other 3 typhoons. All typhoons blow the centre line tanks and accelerate to mach 1.2 in full military power and then to mach 1.75 using reheat. All ECR-90`s are activated and targets sorted via JTIDS gods eye view. No need to deploy the TRD (TOWED RADAR DECOY). At 35 miles and closing the typhoons computer told each AMRAAM where its target A-4/mirage was. The 32 AMRAAM missiles were now screaming to be unleashed. The engagement tone in the earphones was now high pitched and the TD box in the HUD flashed indicating optimum time to launch. All typhoon pilots via voice command instructed “select AMRAAM 1 -8” and pulled the trigger. With 8 dull thuds the angry AMRAAMS screamed away from each of the typhoons and in seconds became distant twinkling lights. Each typhoon pilot now focused on the remaining 2 ASRAAMS awaiting any “leakers” escaping the AMRAAM umbrella…………………………………….
Another scenario.
A small group of Argentinian special soldiers that were landed from subs attack the 4 Typhoons on the ground. Most got killed and the rest got captured however they did manage to blow the Typhoons to smithereens first…….
LokeNah… France seems to like to go it alone with its defense projects. They wouldn’t buy T-50 for the same reason they won’t buy the F-35. They like to design their own equipment to fit their needs and ensure a competitive industrial/technological base.
Still they tried to become part of the Eurofighter consortium. That didn’t work out of course, but they did try I believe.
France will IMHO not be able to build a 5. gen fighter on their own. Too expensive.
I would not expect them to buy T-50, but rather enter in a collaboration with Russia, perhaps based on tech transfer both ways.
If it’s not France, then what European country are we talking about? Germany perhaps? They got the Typhoon and is not part of the F-35 gang.
It could be either, or perhaps both?
LokeFrom Moscow Defense Brief
That opens up very alluring and hitherto inconceivable prospects of cooperation between the Russian aerospace industry and some European aerospace powers which still retain a large degree of sovereignty and independence from the United States.
Now, what “European aerospace powers with a large degree of sovereignity” could that be?
Could it be France!?
France sells Mistral to Russia — perhaps they will get something in return…?
LokeI’ll wait to comment when I see confirmation.
Donley’s spokesman, Lt. Col. Jeffrey Glenn, confirms that his answer was indeed a shift for the official IOC date.
Still you probably got a point — Ares is not always very reliable, flightglobal seems more reliable.
LokeHow many times is it newsworthy? How many times do we need to hear the same story? And when they get the thing under control and it enters service and the pilots and maintainers love it will Bill be telling us about it? Nope. When it goes into exercises and dominates will Bill tell us week after week how fantastic the jet is? Nope.
:confused: This was the first time I saw a news report that IOC was shifted to 2015.
Can you please link us to the other news reports reporting this already?
LokeCheck the date. Seems reports are being recycled weekly to make the problem appear bigger than it is. I’m guessing we’ll hear next week about how *gasp* there’s been a year delay as if that is NEW information.
No need to complaint — the real news is worse than you would expect:
IOC delayed to 2015… pcfem and Spudmanwp where are you?
Sweetman says: “naysayers 1 JSF program 0”. Irritating, isn’t it?
LokeCommercial supplement
Commercial supplement:
Russia’s Sukhoi stealth fighter tested
This online supplement is produced and published by Rossiyskaya Gazeta (Russia), which takes sole responsibility for the content.Heiner Klemm, Russia Now
Published: 6:27PM GMT 25 Feb 2010PAK FA: Sukhoi’s latest fighter could be in service by 2015 Photo: http://www.sukhoi.org
Russia’s state-owned Sukhoi aviation company has flight tested a fifth-generation fighter jet, the PAK FA. The plane is thought to incorporate stealth technology and comes with air-to-air, air-to-surface, and air-to-ship missiles, as well as twin 30mm cannon.Set to enter service in 2015, Sukhoi’s PAK FA is designed to compete with America’s F-22 Raptor, the only other fifth-generation fighter plane in production. The Raptor’s $146m (ÂŁ94m) price tag meant that President Barak Obama cancelled orders for more Raptors in October last year.
Sukhoi won a tender to build the PAK FA in 2002, replacing similar projects to build a fifth-generation jet fighter that had been discussed since the late Eighties.
The jet will have a speed of 1,250mph and a range of up to 3,500 miles, according to information released by Sukhoi.
“This is a great success of both Russian science and Russian design. This achievement rests upon a co-operation team comprising more than 100 of our suppliers and strategic partners,” Sukhoi chief Mikhail Pogosyan said.
He added that the plane – along with its fourth-generation fighters – would “define Russian Air Force potential” for decades to come.
“Sukhoi plans to further elaborate on the PAK FA programme, which will involve our Indian partners.
“I am strongly convinced that our joint project will excel against its Western rivals in cost-effectiveness and will… gain a significant share of the world market,” Pogosyan said.
Even after the Cold War, Russia continues to produce state-of-the-art arms and has seen exports of military equipment soar in recent years. While still far from challenging America’s lead, Anatoly Isaikin, director general of Russian arms exporter Rosoboronexport, says that Russia’s contract portfolio rose to ÂŁ20.5bn from ÂŁ14bn over the year in 2009.
Interesting, they are quite bold with the 2015 date… But then again this is marketing…
LokeIs the MMRCA for a fighter or a multirole strike fighter? I was under the impression this was for a strike fighter. I think this has drifted towards whos the better ATA discussion. They already have SU-30mki for air defense. Honestly if the whole weapons arsenal is available I think the SH is the clear winner over any of the other candidates just because how mature and proven it is in the ATG role while still being extremely capable as a air to air asset as well. The others may surpass it in the ATG role eventually but none are as mature (at least to my knowledge)
Well they are not purchasing an a/c for today but for introduction in a few years (2012?) and it will operate for, say, 30 years. So the fact that the SH is more mature today may not be that important. I am not saying it’s not an advantage (of course it is) I just question how important an advantage it is.
Cost and ToT may be more important; here SH will score high on the first and probably quite low on the second… another important one is “politics”, Perhaps SH scores higher than the others also here?
IMHO, SH, Rafale and Typhoon can all win this, with Gripen as the “dark horse”.
I would rank them as follows:
1. Typhoon (ToT, fantastic a2a, great growth potential in a2g)
2. SH (due to lower price and politics)
3. Rafale (excellent a/c however too expensive that’s why it’s third — and also some question marks around engine thrust…)
Gripen NG? I really don’t know — if they can be happy with a lighter multi-role, it could be one of the favorites!?
Sign In
