It IS rubbish. Like the rest of the crap from Russia. China is forced to buy Russian crap because it can’t buy western 🙁

You don’t see Russian cars, refrigerators and earthmovers in China. You see Mercedes, Haier and Caterpillar.

In a war with the US, the Tu’s will die as quickly as the H-6s but will have cost a hell of lot more.

The Su-30 is also crap when compared to Western planes. Armed by crappy missiles that probably won’t work in wartime. Especially with the degraded down versions that Russia always screws its clients with.

The slaughter we see in the records of the F-16 and F-15, ~400 to 0, are pretty damning of the crap that China has no choice but to buy.

If it could it would buy Western or develop its own. At least the homegrown stuff when it gets blown up was far less expensive to buy in the first place.

This is the truth.

Originally posted by aerospacetech
Erm:

Possibility 1: An unknown artist produces a detailed cutaway of a secret Chinese plane, J-10B, which hasn’t ever been seen in public, presumably after stealing the plans from Chengdu. Somehow, sections of it look exactly like a Lavi, not like the single seat J-10 already seen, including a boom-type refuelling system completely incompatible with existing Chinese infrastructure.

Possibility 2: An artist fakes a detailed cutaway of a secret Chinese plane, J-10B, using an existing Lavi cutaway altered to look like a J-10. Many details remain incorrect.

I vote for 2.

End of discussion 😉

Idiot. Why the cloak and dagger stealing blueprints BS?

Nobody is saying that the schematic is real. It’s an artist impression. In fact, the Lavi schema might not be entirely accurate either, who could tell? It was an ARTIST impression.

What JTMS is saying is that artist for the Lavi and the J-10B might be the same person since he had changed the wings and placed missiles behind the goddam wings.

PSing can’t allow you to do this. I’ve enough understanding and control of 2D tools to tell that reshaping the goddam wings without redrawing the entire f*cking things is not possible. Putting the goddam missiles behind the wings isn’t easy.

So it is highly possible that:

1. artist draws impression of Lavi

2. artist draws impression of J-10B using his previous impression of the Lavi as a base

An artist don’t have to “fake” his own impression of what a J-10B might look like.

What I build a J-10B model, it’s my impression. I don’t have to “fake” my goddam work.

So some creative Chinese guy used a Lavi schematic as a base, big deal 😀

Originally posted by Erez
WTF????
GD, I don’t claim anything about the Chinese people, just on the J-10! Did I ever said anything about the Chinese except of facts? NEVER EVER!:mad:

No facts but racist innuendos and implied stereotypes.

Come on, you don’t really think that the Israeli government would approve that kind of thing?

If they did not approve and the Israeli government said they didn’t sell the Lavi which the US had asked them not to THEN there is no chance that the J-10 ever came from the Lavi.

Unless the Israeli had lied on this account. Which YOU, not me, are implying.

Golden Dragon, for the last time.
As far as I know, Israel has assisted in the development of the J-10 to a certain extent. As far as I believe, the J-10 is a development of the Lavi.

So you believed that that Israel government lied and had, in American colloquial, “backstabbed” them. You are saying this, not me.

Anyhow, there are billion Chinese. I don’t know what are they capable of, but history shows that most of the aircraft the Chinese industry produced are either Russian designs or a development of ones.

You racist. I see you are predicating that 1 billion Chinese can do nothing but make copies. The Chinese and the Israeli government have both denied this and yet you believe otherwise out of your own prejudice concerning the stupidity of the Chinese.

For now, I can’t prove it because I still don’t have solid proves

You have no solid proofs but still you want to believe that the Israelis lied and the Chinese are incapable. This is exactly what defines racism.

But don’t call me racist. Rasicm killed half of my family.

Sorry to hear that but for too many people like you, only racism against your own kind is bad but not your own racism against others.

I lost a grandmother and family members to a Japanese gas attack in WWII. Nobody cared that Japan used chemical and biological weapons in China or they killed even more people there than the German did to Jews. I don’t talk about nor would it make any difference.

Erez, you’d be smart not make me and the Chinese start hating you because of your own racism. We’ve no history against you or your people. There is no reason for Chinese to be anti-semitic because we don’t believe the religious stuff about Christ killing that makes some Christians and Muslims hate Jews.

If we start hating Jews it is only because of racism from people like you directed towards us.

Where are the missiles? It might be based on that Lavi drawing but if it is the exact same picture then how the hell do you ps three-quarters angle missiles to the schematic and then put them underneath the wings?

You have to draw the things to scale, numbnuts.

Also, your Lavi cutaway looks exactly like numerous F-16 cutaways. Of course, the F-16 is what that failed Israeli project was based on.

Seeing the little pilots drawings to the left and also the way the canopy was drawn over, I would say that someone was using this as a map for a 3D model and scene, maybe a game.