Merlin3945Well not entirley bang in the centre of Penicuik but heres a snippet.
Spitfire R7152 from 58 OTU based at Grangemouth crashed 5 miles NW of Penicuik during a cross country exercise. The aircraft flew into high ground.
The Pilot survived.
Merlin3945The third picture looks like it could have been bombed on account that the props a still quite straight and they have not been bent by a bad landing or crash damage.
And few of the other look to be in similar circumstances. Unless you find someone else that was there it would be impossible to confirm the story or indeed to rubbish it.
I suggest we take the guys word for it as he was actually there. We were not.
Merlin3945Sounds about right Cees but some folks think that EVERYTHING MUST be preserved.
And as mentioned before everyone has a right to their own opinion. As of yet I have never sold anything I have recovered as I have no idea of the legal issues that accompany the route. I guess some folks just get the wrong idea of just what it is us folks do.
So that is why I will post no more on the subject.
Merlin3945Mark V,
As everyone has pointed out at some point or another we are all entitled to our own opinions.
So what would you do with piles of corroded useable metal?
Not every museum will be interested in the efforts of your dig. So what else do you do with it.
Hide it away in your shed or back garden?
Leave it on site? Which raises the question if you know it was there in the first place and leave it there why bother digging it up. (Of course digging things up has a lot more involved than just digging it has to do with understanding the wreck itself and hopefully getting a really nice find)
If it were me I would have photographed all pieces of wreck not going to be kept or given away and created a dvd/cd rom of the pictures then smelted the remaining scrap to be made into die cast models to be sold with the cds and a certificate telling the buyer of the dig that their model came from. All profits to be given to a named charity.
Doenst sound like that bad an idea to me. But of course that is my opinion and what my idea of unsuable and useless is might be entirely different to yours.
Merlin3945Cmon guys we are not talking about a war grave here or indeed a complete aircraft. What these aircraft are is essentially scrap metal. All that you really get from wreck sites other than those few which have been used to restore the aircraft to completion is a couple of engines under cart and some dataplates if you are lucky. Anything else is a bonus. Usually all other finds would be small and to think that the whole aircraft was still there relatively intact was amazing to see. After the dig was done and for instance nothing was removed what would you have liked done with the parts. I would have salvaged all usable or intact parts and then smelted the rest for casting small cast models of the aircraft. After all what most museums want are not lots of corroded white powder.
Dont get me wrong with this though I do like to see complete aircraft recovered and preserved but it does have its limits.
Merlin3945Well having been involved with a few digs now after the first dig in which a press photographer was with us we now do all our own pictures and stories and if we want our story in the press we will go to them with our pictures and story. It was only by luck that the press had just left when we made the discovery that stopped the dig. If we had still had the press there I dont know what would have happened.
But to be fair and honest the time team and crew did a lot better on this dig that had been done with the first. At least now they have got into the thinking about how to excavate aircraft. which is get a digger into do the work and jetwash the whole thing down. Would have liked to have had a jet wash to hose me down the last time I ended up in the mud.
Well done. Good viewing.
Merlin3945During the Kings Cup Air Race 1928 one particular aircraft crashed while it is thought the pilot became disorientated in low cloud. He crashed near St Marys loch in the Borders.
Have a look here and search for ANEC Missel Thrush G-EBPI. Just searching by the serial will give you a look at the photos from our outing. Bloody hard work treking those hills for what little was found but worth every step to know that we found the aircraft.
To my knowledge he was the only fatality ever during the air races but if you know different then please let me know. Contacts are on the site homepage.
Merlin3945Looking at all those aircraft crashes,was it particularly a dangerous place/time or is it just an indication of sheer quantities of flights and therefore the incidents would be higher?
Trumper I may have gotten you wrong but I think the word “Stick” and “wrong end of” come to mind with your statement.
The address I posted was for the listings of aircraft that attended the Malta airshows over those particular years.
The Accidents I refer to are on http://www.acia.co.uk and you will find that if you look at some of the phantoms that crashed in the 70s and 80s that a few have picture and details of them on the Malta site.
I am currently doing a little web trawling to find additional info and pictures of said aircraft.
Merlin3945David, I really couldnt care less about whether or not they had WMD. Our government clearly wanted Saddam after the last war and this was only the excuse they needed to go back a second time. I didnt have the same enthausiasm to see our soldiers killed as some but supported our troops in the war. How the Fury was aquired really doesnt matter to me and until someone owns up or someone has info on how it was aquired From the horses mouth so to speak then we will never know. Lets just hope it was aquired legally. But on saying that if we were at war and were the conquering nations then surely things such as these are fair game to liberate.
Or perhaps they were locally own after the forces bugged out so were bought for mere tuppence.
Does anyone actually know if it has been aquired and how etc.
Hatton, Selfish or not that is how I feel about things these days. People are far to nice these days not enough people standing up and saying how they feel these days without thinking about offending people. I have grown tired of the world as is and would like more people to say what they mean and mean what they say.Honesty is the best policy and all that.
Now how much bull in one paragraph was that.
Hatton, I hope that the aircraft was obtained legally but I would rather see it looked after and in a museum or in the air than lying in a desert somewhere where the local wildlife go to pee on it every morning. This is why I dont really care how it has been obtained.
Merlin3945To be quite frank guys. Who bloody cares just get them restored and back in the air where they belong.
Past caring about all the bull politics just get as many restored planes back in the air as we can.
Merlin3945There was a program on tv not that long ago that said Rudolph Hess was actually onboard that aircraft.
The story goes that Hess being as important as he was got put up in a highland cottage and an lookalike got taken to the tower of London. The cottage was by a lake and this was how they got delayed when they landed and picked up Hess.
Later after the aircraft had crashed they found all the bodies in or around the aircraft. Some could not be indentified and an other airman was found wandering down the hill. I have no idea if he later died or what but he was and extra crewmember so it would seem that there was one too many on board.
So thats the story. Please no critisisms on the story as I am only retelling the story as it was on the TV.
Merlin3945Well Sconnor,
I dont think anyone called you a liar out right but rather it was inferred that the visual evidence was indeed in breech of you so called eye witness report.
We All know the Hanna’s past and present are great flyers and indeed I would love to see more of this type of flying as its great for the pilot and spectators but today only a few lucky folk get to see this in what is now “closed events”
Rightly so I guess as public safety is at an all time high.
To say that this was 50 feet I myself would call you a liar perhaps the cameramans distance away using Telephoto from the aircraft would make it 50 feet above you but the presenter is under 25 feet away from a cut and blow dry.
Does anyone remember the part in Dark Blue World where the spit passes really low over the ground. Cant remember the exact bit but it is the lowest I have ever seen any aircraft apart from one landing. Well having never seen the film I bought it on DVD on a friends rating and enjoyed it. Right where the spit passes low I said to my wife that it would be Ray Hanna flying that Aircraft and to my surprise who was it flying??
I rest my case. You can even tell Ray Hanna from the way he flies his aircraft.
And Sconnor if you feel like leaving the forum then fair enough but calling people A*sholes just because they question your judgement I think you should be kicked out not allowed to leave.
Merlin3945Congrats Ian.
Going on for the greater good I assume Ian.
Ian dont know if your interested or not but there is a rather knackered but nice old Fairey Gannet lying up at Errol that needs the owner persuading to part with. Interested at all.
email you later mate.
Regards Scott.
Merlin3945That is what I was saying earlier the requirements for a ferry permit are very different to the requirement’s for a full permit to fly.
Before it had its wings cut off it was structurally sound and so it was suitable for a ferry flight permit.
Thats how the Sea Vixen got from Swansea to Bournemouth back in 2000 as the type had not been given a permit to fly at the time.
I dont actually believe it was though Andrewman. As far as I am aware most of the damage had been done to this aircraft to keep the fleet flying and more or less all the flight computer were stripped out as well so a ferry flight was not on the cards.
If in doubt or dispute with this then why not try and email or mail BA direct I am sure they will advise you on the previous situation or perhaps they no longer take interest in flying aircraft.
Merlin3945Thanks Scott. Just to push my point a little further, wouldn’t it be nice to see scenes like this again at East Fortune. 🙂
Certainly would. Can just see the Bolingbroke and Beaufighter sitting out at the end of the runway gleaming in the sun. Ready for another sortie.
Well we are all allowed to dream arent we.
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