french market always was for simpler design, i mean they didnt made f-4s, Mig-25s, f-15s, su-27s, etc.., there market was mirage3s, f-16, mig-21, etc..

now, saying that the typhoon is an counter to the f-16 have no sense, is more a counter of the f-15, su-27 or f-22

then what the hell they were thinking to go in that market, when they did very well with the traditional design philosophy????

the rafale, ahhh the rafale

In the 60s was a competiton between Mirage 3 and Mig-21, you cant count the F-4 due it size and cost, the 21s were the commies

In the 70s was the F1 vs mig-23, the f-15 was -is- pretty costly, the 23 were the commies

Now, again the M2000 didnt had western competition in the 80s, the f16, cant match the high altitude fighter-interceptor role, dont know if the tornado could, but by that time the tornado was a outdated design, besides the torny is more in the f-15 leage, the commie counter part was the mig-29, so some countries that had the f-16, also wanted the M2000, coz the 16 isnt a real counter to the fulcrum -which is more a pocked f-15-, thats the reason why some f-16 users also wanted the M2000…despite the ridiculous high price……ohh it had a western counter…the f-18…ermmm…yeah…..sure……

i think that the french did the right thing getting not involved into the Tornado project, the M2000 was a great success

but was a bad idea to make an almost clone of the Typhoon, both the Rafale and EF are almost the same, the winning hand was for the EF, because more countries were involved

Im pretty sure that if they would made a simpler and different plane like the Gripen, that would be cheaper due the experience and infrestructure, now many air forces would have it, maybe a resurection of the mirage 3,actually the best choice would have been an aliance with saab

If you see the sales of the mirage 3, where went all that market?, the price of the modern jets are too much for many air forces, the planes are getting overpriced and overcomplicated, crappy cold war competition, why the french didnt see that?

just another subsonic cruiser missile, big deal

anyway, supossely this missile is linked with some new gizmo named maraburu or something like that, which use the already well known ionization concept to reduce it rcs, even a russian colonel, sargent,comodore or whatever said that, so that gizmo exist??

SOC, if FSW have stealth features, then we should watch in the sky many FSW UAVs, because FSW is more suitable to subsonic speed

FSW dont have stealth features, the believe of some guys that the reflected waves are absobed by the fuselage are far from the reallity, because to do that you need an impossible angle due to the problems of the aspect ratio, , the leading edge perimeter is shorter, increasing the density of the wave returned -with the same span compared of a conventional wing-, actually fsw increase the radar signature returning the wave to the source, FSW is more efficient as a lifter at near supersonic speed than rectangular wings, but also have it structural problems, you dont see any extensive program based on stealth features that follow fsw-even with its aerodynamical features- ,guess why..

just try to draw a normal line from the 3/4 external portion of the s-47 fsw -taking the leading edge angle and taking in consideration that is a high wing and the nose and fuselage is a a lower level-, that wont work to hide it from the radars

ok, i just came here, just take a look, didnt want get into this thread, but is obvious that a fan eye is different with an engieneer eye..just found that dumd commentaries…”ity looks ugly, fat, etc” without any sustance

the stealth design is much -MUCH- better than the barracuda and in some aspects better than the x-45, it just follow simple rules for a stealth plane, avoid internal angles, low wing configuration, avoid surfaces pointing downwards, the stuff is big, dont know about the operational weights, anyone could tell me??, anyway is still a mockup, but the design is very good

well if canards, tailplanes or whatever are aligned -like canards on the su-30- there isnt difference, canards, in general are smaller than tailplanes so that could be even better for a stealth design, but the point is that if you increase the number of control surface, you increase radar reflective behaviour

and dont trust in TV, because full syntetic stability isnt practical, you need your engines to thrust the plane, but you cant use them completely for stabilization, that decrease the general performance of a plane, you need aerodynamics

Flanker man, im talking about fighters, yes russians have a nice experience in big deltas, but in bombers and transport planes….and prototipes, the aerodesign of a fighter is a bit more complex, because are more requirements, dont know how the russians are good to handle deltas at high aoa ,yes some guys could start with the TVC stuff, but im sure that the russians WANT high aerodynamical sustentable AoA and not only a mechanical one

dont know the performance of the mig144, if the investigations and the prototipe was good enough, maybe they could consider that design, but i doubt that the 144 would reached it design goals

they must make some sacrifices, they cant make a wonder plane -btw the f22isnt a wonder plane, so isnt a big deal- i think will be “sacrifices” on supercruiser -i mean range , not speed-, the plane wont have internal bay, and other things, that anyway seems unpractical

because the figures of f120 never were published, man im only saying what i know, i dont come here the forums with a book or searching links, i have a life you know?

bring it on, come on thats the typical “with special materials blah,blah,blah”, lol, if that is all now all we should be designers, actually in engienreeng the important concepts are the simpler, for example what is more effective your “microns coating” and all that stuff for IR signature, or just to increase the outlet area to reduce the pressure -and temperature- of the gases? (like in f23 and b-2), get some education first before to read all that rubish

come on sferrin, dont you remember that thread?, is happening again…