star49purchase of French aircraft, avionics, electronic warfare and collaboration in defence with France
Now this is consistent with my information trying to get French EW Suite and avionics.
In addition to F-16 sale there is serious leg pulling going on with RD-93.
star49I was referring to you and your flagrant a*ss kissing of anyone who has anything to do with Pak, even some third rate dictators like Kim Jong Il. 😀
It is personal opinion if some body is third rate or first rate. Every thing depends on Interests. So your statements does not make any difference.
And a handful of MiG29’s makes them a conduit of Russian weaponry? LOL
Bangladesh has had MiG29’s…why dont you fellows approach them? 😀
You claimed they have nothing. MIG-29 has better agility than Su-30 and can share good deal of information about engines and problems.
About components you can guess. It is more related to Russian missile tech 😀
I have also heard that Russians have learned great deal about maintaining RD-33 in hot climate of India. PAF was very impressed with that knowledge 😀
star49Sure, we all admire Kim Jong Il- he is the epitome of excellence. He supplies weapons to Pak, we admire him for that. Etc, etc.
no body is saying you admire them.
LOL. That is why the North Korean AF is equipped with Su30’s, their army has UOMZ T90’s…anymore BS?
They have MIG-29 for past 17 years and can supply components of various things as required.
star49LOL. The Kaveri is being *tested* in Russia using Russian *test facilities*, unlike the indigenous FC1 designed and developed by CATIC, flown by CATIC pilots and which comes equipped with an instruction booklet in Mandarin. Unlike the Norinco MBT 2000 which Pak has provided green paint for.
What is CATIC? You are embrassing yourself with your limited knowledge
ROTFL. The Arjun is in IA service now, they can do what they want with it. Unlike your FC1 , which is being designed and developed by the Chinese but then the PAF is shameless enough to brag on AFM that it “designed and developed the FC1”.
Your statement cannot make enter into service. About AFM bragging there is no other public information since than so it must be true. 😀
star49good job Yahoo, not only are your logics flawed, you turned a thread about radar into one about tanks. 😮 :rolleyes:
The same logic is applied to other spheres.
“When it comes to say tanks, ammunition and even fighter planes there are powerful lobbies at work. The humiliation that MBT Arjun is facing today, the LCA will face tomorrow,” says Gupta, 71.
star49This is example of false induction.
The Arjun Main Battle Tank being developed since 1974, with specifications changing often and under trial since 1988, and “handed over” to the Indian Army a number of times, is now expected to be supplied against the most recent order of 125 tanks during the next three years. In the overall picture, this would be a token induction
star49Nirav,
The RD33 is now French- you see thats what the PAF meant when they said the FC1 would be Yoorupean, no Russian stuff for them, they buy only from the best. Like the North Koreans. Best there is. Kim Jong Il Inc follows Six Sigma, TQM and all his facilities are ISO 9000 certified. Believe you me. :rolleyes:
Both North Korea and South Korea are very talented nations of East. One is communist and other capitalist.(both are against VETO to certain large Asian country 😮 )There is nothing wrong with there build quality or technolgy. NK is conduit of Russian weopons.
star49may Allah help the FC-1 then….. uses a russian engine … doesn’t it ?? :rolleyes:
You understand the word Treatment? Russia will build the RD-33 according to there best quality to increase its exports while they will screw up foreign engines like Kaveris. I think they have given a very fair treatment to Kaveris 😀
star49Umm if you can give us an example of an a/c that actually mates an armament and is NOT capeable of launching it it would be helpful. Now i think you will be in the minority if you claim that the Bisons arent capeable of launching the RVV. The whole point of an avionics upgrade would have been moot.
Your definition of BVR is very interesting. So if you are on the pakistani side of LOC (on a clear day) and I can SEE you from the Indian side (I donno a good 10 kms), does that mean that such an engagement needs BVR? Coz by your definition you are on your side. Also if you cross over to Indian territory and your painted as a Foe by ADS do I need to see you to engage you? I understand this might be your new theory after the “two BVR” hypothesis. Very interesting. Never seen such an eloquent foot-in-mouth.
What false impression has Kaveri or Arjun given? They both have never claimed to launch the RVV. You said that south asians use mock ups ….are you claiming that bother are mock ups now?
That was war time and PAF and IAF fighters suppose to stay 10kM away from borders.
And about Kaveris isnt the word indegenous and and collapse outside the country a bit awkward.
It is not difficult to find news about Arjun and its false inductions.
star49I thought you were trying to prove that the Bison dont really carry RVV. How where does the Mig-29 come into the picture? Also how exactly does India justify shooting down F-16 that are NOT on their side of the LOC. They were painted well withing pakistani side. And if you watch “Akashy Yoddha” it clear states that. When the Atlantique came across the IB it got its just desserts and that too from a lowly Mig-21.
Also since I dont follow your brand of logic I dont understand how Arjun MBT comes into the picture. There are pics of it but it does not carry RVV and it does what its supposed to do and it never claimed to be carry RVV. Like I said you need to come up with better examples of “mock ” missiles “hanging” from south asian a/c that are intended to mislead. I am sure you will find lot of those based on yoru claim.
What does an engine or pics of a engine have to do with RVV?? I dont think there were any claimes made about it either? Its still in development and there are pics that show precisely that. I dont remember seeing any pics of it having RVV or makign any extra orrdinary claims.
Please try again.
It can carry as it has hard point but it is not sured that particular aircraft is upgraded to fire it. thats the whole point. the picture is from test aircraft and that not in flying condition.
And What is the purspose of BVR to hit the other side on the other side. Inside you can use WVR.
Engines, Tanks stories all these point towards a particular culture of giving false impressions.
star49I dont recall hearing about the Bison ever been paraded (remember you implied missiles that ‘hang’ from the Bison are fakes since thats how this whole discussion started) If you can prove that only one Bison was ever upgraded and the rest of the IAF No.3 fakes then that would really help your claim.
Since you further claim that south asia is “deeply infected” by it you should have no problems coming up with proof. After you furnish the proof we really would have not reason to continue this discussion indeed. After all you can always argue that since there are no pictures of the IAF ever firing a RVV-AE from any a/c then none of them can actually fire it….forget the Bison not the Mig-29/K/MKI. But then wont that be illogical coz your argument is that pictures are misleading and any a/c with missiles cant really fire them. That means that Mig-23/25/27/Jag/M2K can actually fire RVV-AE coz they are not pictured with them right??
Remember the lock on claims of MIG-29 without firing a BVR and several time induction of Arjun when it is not in operational service even now. The same is true of Indegnous Kaveri when finally it collapsed in a foreign country. It needs medical treatment in France or US not Russia. 😀
star49First missiles dont ‘hang’ from a/c they are ‘mated’ to their platforms using adapters to which establish electronic interphase. Second of all, if you extend that logic nothing nothing is real. WHy stop at the armament being real even the a/c is not real if its on the ground. Third of all by your logic if an a/c actually flies and launches these missiles it could very well be digital imagery to “meant to give false impressions to the other side”. Finally why stop at the ‘south asian’ why not the europeans or the north americans? Why do you think that what they ‘hang’ from their planes are real and not fakes? Were you present for each and every armament testing phase to know for sure that this is turly a ‘South Asian’ disease?
Like I said…I really love your logic a few examples would certainly help your cause. Or would you like to run off to your other forum to solicit some much needed help in justifying your _ _ _ _ _ _ Logic?
In South Asia failed projects are paraded. Premature induction cermonies are held. It is automatically assumed from upgradation of one aircraft that all are upgraded. You can see this things from the local media where every thing is wrong because the reality behind the news is wrong. If there is live video of actual missile firing from one aircraft so it only means only that aircraft is upgraded not the rest.
Now i dont want to contiue on this. This disease is present every where but South Asia is deeply infected with it. 😀
star49Thats not how your initial statment reads. You alleged that “In South Asia pictures are meant to give false impressions to the other side” so now if you can back up your claim of “most of the missiles are empty mockups” with some concrete examples it would really help your claim.
If i give picture of missiles hanging from an aircraft or lying in front of aircraft. It does not mean that missile is integrated to that aircraft or it is real missile. How can you prove it otherwise that it can fire what it can carry.
Every thing from top to bottom is fake.
star49Yes….thats why there are so many photoshopped and CGI images of LCA, MKI, Migs….
Also please note the red star and the 21-93 bort thats DEFINATELY taken in south asia…..for giving false impressions.
And during Cope India the F-15 were on the ground when they were engaged by the Bisons lest we have the impressions that they were actually flying.
I have seen this aircraft photo at rusarm.ru. I am not referring to photoshopped images of fans but real military show cases. most of the missiles are empty mockups.
star49It’s good to see some one here questioning the rise of baseless claims and assumptions.
In South Asia pictures are meant to give false impressions to the other side. They have no value. I am not questioning MIG-21 ability to carry 4 missiles as they are now used for ground attacks.
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