I think Indian FGFA will carry the meteor & Astra 🙂
I also think the SW codes etc may be different.
Hmm its possible. I guess it depends on what comes out of Russia as the primary PAK-FA armament (not talking about RVV-SD and BD).
http://www.lenta.ru/news/2011/11/02/price/
Agreed upon prices for subs:
Severodvinsk:
1.5 billion USD.
Yuri Dolgoruki, and Alexander Nevsky:
750 million USD each.
http://www.lenta.ru/news/2011/11/02/carrier/
Russian carrier project will be ready by 2017, first ship to be launched in 2023. Ship will be nuclear. Second vessel planned by 2027.
Admiral Kuznetsov going for refit and modernization in 2012, to be completed by 2017.
I dont think RuAF will accept half baked PakFa. Again, I am waiting for his article about what he has to say about FGFA. This discussion can be postponed until then.
I want to be clear I wasn’t attacking you, just that dudes statements.
It seems some are convinced RuAF will settle for interim PAK-FA systems, but whos rear end that idea came from, I have no clue. The next-stage engine development started before the 1st flight, same with all the sensors etc. This is not something questionable.
I think Indian FGFA may not be necessarily better than the Russian one, but it would be different in a few aspects including long range AAMs.
What about long range AAMs will be different?
I doubt the programme will hold a candle to the American jet if you take fighter vs fighter only.
Oh it will more than hold a candle :diablo:
😉
Honestly, mark my words, FGFA will be much much closer to PAK-FA than some people suspect. And that is a good thing.
Uh….
They did actually.
Chengdu offered an Navalized verison of J-10 and some thingelse.
PLAN went to the route with which schedule risks are minimized.
.
I obviously meant between the two aircraft this whole discussion was about.
Like the PLAN had a choice between the MiG-29K and the Su-33. They didn’t. They nabbed a Su-33 from Ukraine, and thats it. Not like they had comparative trials or anything.
Which isn’t to say it was a horrible choice, given Chinese experience making Flankers domestically.
You know, the kind of trials the RuNavy can actually hold between the two.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=S5CF-nK4-PQ#!
The video that the screencaps were jacked from.
Aren’t the Flankers generally accepted to have superior aerodynamic performance, cockpit visiblity, range et al over the Fulcrum? Plus room for more powerful radars, EW systems, a greater range/payload, especially with short takeoffs and so on…
I would be carefull when comparing the two aerodynamically ;). Cockpit visibility of KUB is no worse, maybe even better. Radar is naturally bigger, but so is the RCS. The range thing is what we have been debating, and nobody on here has specifics. Flanker can certainly have more internal space, but can it take off with max payload and fuel? How is the takeoff/flight performance with this layout? What about short range missions, and fuel consumption? Given all the factors, I don’t find it surprising the MiG-29K might be better suited to operations on both the Vik and the Kuz.
Likewise the RuAF(what you’re referring to above is the AV-MF I believe)
Yeah sorry just went for typing shortcut there.has gone for only limited upgrades on many of their older aircraft: MiG-29s and Flankers with only Zhuk-M radars instead of Bars/Zhuk-A and similar older avionics, Su-24 bulk upgrades etc.
But all of those upgrades are more substantial than what the S-33 got. They COULD have easily gone for a modest upgrade like Su-27SM, but they chose not to. MiG-29 in RuAF has not been upgraded at all actually, and putting Bars on Su-27 requires serious work.
The Su-33s are due for replacement around 2015-16, so a limited overhaul is all they needed.
The Su-33 is planned to be operated past 2020, up to 2025. So they do intend to keep it around, yet still did not bother with an easily achievable serious upgrade. I think it is clear they are more interested in the MiG-29K.
ten chars.
It’s logical that a Flanker airframe would be superior in performance to a Fulcrum airframe with comparable avionics and systems.
That said the Su-33s are nearing the end of their useful life. As per previous articles upgrading and refurbishing them was(and possibly still is) on the table. .
But where is the logic? Does anyone here have all the performance parameters, as it applies to carrier aviation, to really say, Su-33 is clearly superior to MiG-29? I don’t think so. Performance is more than a bigger radar, and more potential internal fuel space.
RuAF opted for minimal Su-33 overhaul, when they could have gone for a much more thorough one. Seems to me like they made a conscious decision as a result of decades of Su-33 operation
You are just digging your heels in here, so whatever. I prefer to look at the actions of the Ru and Indian navies, and draw from there.
Do you have firm data that the Su-33 can launch a fully laden strike without being refueled, within the limits of C&C that either India or Russia can provide? The buddy refueling capability of the K absolutely provides flexibility, even if you don’t want to improve strike range, just in persistence, and on station duration.
http://russianplanes.net/images/to58000/057653.jpg
Not really Russian, but….weird plane to be sure.
http://ttvnol.vcmedia.vn/images/52/dsdsad_1320142965.png
Upgrade A-50 interior.
Parts of Reply Ajai Shukla (Indian journo and former Tankman) gave in his Broadsword blog on the F 35 for India issue. Some of it seems relevant here.
http://ajaishukla.blogspot.com/2011/11/end-this-mmrca-hara-kiri.html
Yeah, this is nonsense to put lightly.
So…that disproves nothing I said, in the context of the MiG-29K and the Su-33 on the Kuz.
How is it a useless argument, if MiG has recently been seen trialing the refueling pod and tank capacity of the MiG-29K? Why do you think they did that? For ****s and giggles? Surely couldn’t be because the Russian or Indian navies were interested in that capability!
oh the old bucket brigade argument again.
look, if that’s saves fuel then USAF would have brought strategic bombers with little or no fuel tanks.
So disprove me, in the context of the Kuznetsov.