I agree acquisition of a new aircraft to recapitalise airforce is completely the right thing to do.

As I’ve said, there are no guarantees money will be available in future either (though I’m sure Scooter would say something along the lines of “when economy is better, they will buy F-35.” :p ).

If there’s any offensive action against Serbia, a few MiG-29Ms with R-77 won’t stop the foreigners from rolling Serbian AF over.

Of course the only group capable of performing any offensive action is NATO and they’d have F-22s + F-15Cs + AWACS + EW providing top cover.

I know. I didn’t mean “threat” as in 6, or even 36 M2s would be able to successfully defend Serbia from full scale NATO attack. More like M2s armed with R-77 are generally a threat to anyone flying over. Even a little Mig-21 Bison is. :eagerness:

http://inserbia.info/news/2013/05/serbian-aviation-seeking-russian-wings/
did you completely miss this part?

“Serbian budget is poor for maintenance and use of modern military aircrafts,” explains Radic. “The exploitation of a squadron would annually swallow at least third of the whole budget of the Serbian Army, which is about $250 million. Company MIG is not able to guarantee supply of parts and maintenance, which would put Serbia at risk and cost of testing the aircrafts and the problems of integration of modern systems.”

The biggest enigma of purchasing new aircrafts will be the payment method, which nobody has officially mentioned. Besides the acquisition of aircrafts is political decision, they also cost. Purchasing new wings with additional content (training, spare parts and equimpment), accoring to experts, could cost up to – EUR 1 billion.

spending 1/3rd of your defense budget just for some shiny new MiGs is not cheap.

– Its not about shiny new migs. its about slow investment for rebirth of one air force. And not temporary covering holes of an outdated air force either. Decision was made to start a new project, if you will. That’s why 6 planes to start with is more than plenty for the next few years at least.

I’m not disagreeing that on the paper Serbia does not have money for six Mig-29Ms. Of coarse we don’t 🙂
Its 100% true that we better give up on air force altogether, and invest in hospitals, and new factories. But that is not going to happen. Decision to buy additional aircraft was made. No one knows how and when they will be paid exactly, and how long will that drag out. Deal might as well include Russian airbase in the middle of Serbia for all we know at this point.

I’m glad they just chose to slowly, and on a small scale rebuild with new.

****

Here is today’s article from same web page. Talks a bit why they are sticking with new Russian technologies after all.

http://inserbia.info/news/2013/05/serbia-buying-russian-aircrafts-and-air-defense-systems/

best regards

Serbia has 3 upgraded Mig-29s today, plus one which i think is not flyable and is used for parts probably (might be wrong on that 4th one) All 4 are grounded.

There is no mystery about it.

The only thing they could do is look for old Mig-29s from other countries who won’t bother fixing them anymore, and get few more old frames like that. Then they have to refurbish them, and maybe do small upgrades. They would be ready by 2015 earliest. That about puts Serbia in 2015 where it was in 1988, except that these frames will have way less time remaining then they did in 1987/8

Poland kind of did this, but that was years ago, and made more sense. Deal was free, and happened quite fast if i remember correctly. Difference is also that Poland along with upgrading migs bought other new aircraft. India as well also needed a lot more aircraft, so they upgraded migs, and bought new aircraft a while ago. Not in 2013 or later.

So you can’t really compare Indian reason for upgrading Mig-29s and Serbia who has 3 grounded old Mig-29s, and nothing new at all.
Getting Mig-29m2s, plus few more Mig-29As for refurbishing does make sense- I agree, but ONLY IF Serbia needed more aircraft at this time. I don’t think it does. Its not going to air war agains any air force any time soon.

Here is todays news (after a log break)on G-4MD, which supports the idea that Serbian airforce is planning to gradually get back to present, and shoot for the future.

Not just buy some inexpensive old cans that can perform duties today.

http://www.politika.rs/rubrike/Drustvo/Nova-elektronika-i-naoruzanje-za-avion-G-4-MD.sr.html

Refurbishing Mig-29As is slow process and short term solution. What is tit, like 10 year life extension or something like that. Besides, Serbia would have to spend money on someone’s old mig-29s first and than smend more money on refurbishing them. Then in few years, they would be in the same situation.

What kind of policing can Yak-130 do if Mig-29, Mig-21, Grippen, or even fast flying comercial jet gets to Serbian airspace for whatever reason. Not only speed, but it also lacks altitude reach. 12,500m is not enough for intercepting neighboring countries existing old fighter fleets. Even comercial jets fly over 11000m often times.

again, i like yak-130, but it is not an interceptor.

ps

my mistake, it is a medium+ fighter, not small/medium like i said.

So, if your cash-strapped friend was about to get a huge bank loan (say, his fifth over the last two years) to buy a new sports car he clearly doesn’t need, you would say to him: “Look at it like an investment, you probably won’t use it for the next 20-30 years. And be content you (hopefully!) get at least a new car, not like the old bangers your neighbours will possibly get…”

It just doesn’t make sense.

As for protecting the land so we can be poor on it. I ask you, how will a handful (even a full squadron of fighters) help Serbia to do that when every one of its neighbours is in NATO and the main threat comes from (potential) internal separatists?

I am all for a respectable Serbian military – I just don’t think this helps. For the air policing role, however, the MiGs are wonderful… wonderful but overkill.

I don’t see how Mig-29M2 is an overkill for policing, and protecting Serbian sky. Its a small/medium multirole airplane fast enough for policing. It can be easily adapted to NATO requirements should Serbia enter NATO in the future. These are also newly built frames that will last a while. And the price – GUARANTEED LOWEST POSSIBLE- probably will be traded for other goods. Otherwise, Serbia will be renting Gripens, or some other western used frames for high price, until ..when??

What is your suggestion they should buy?The only other option I see that is better priced are new frames from China. FC1 or J-10 perhaps.

As for credit, I’m sure it is going to be favorable, nearly symbolic, incorporating many exporting goods from Serbia for good price. Serbia might actually profit from more military cooperation with Russia, specially if factories are built for upgrades and maintenance for range of aircraft, and Mil helicopters. Many countries could use overhauls, frame life extensions, etc. I think that’s the plan anyway.

We’ll know soon anyway. Details will be announced soon after they visit Russia to sign ( May 23 if i remember correctly)

Mig-29M2 would mean more then likely these are some of the Algerian examples. So not exactly new but I presume cheaper then new build Mig-35, beggars can’t be choosy in such matters!

Still rather dubious about the veracity of the announcement as I can’t see how they could pay for them unless the Russians are offloading them with seriously good credit terms.

six already build Mig-29M2s are most likely ones intended for Syrian AF, which deal is now dead. And yes, its a good credit, and cooperation where possibly Serbia might be a equipped to service and upgrade other countries’ older Mig-29s. Majority of the first stage of this deal will be signed before the end of the May when President of Serbia, and minister of defense visit Russia.