VX927It’s not the same one… The one on Barnstormers is a Tornado F3 simulator / procedures trainer being sold by Jetartdesigns…
VX927You’re quite right the press release doesn’t say much you don’t already know, but if you read it in it’s entirety it does say it going out to other fora that may not know about the project. Surely the relevent bit to this forum is
We bring you the launch of “XH558 Press Office” and the first of what will be regular updates across various Internet forums with the intention of spreading the word on this ground breaking aviation project.
Isn’t that what you have all been calling for?
Exactly… That is what we’ve all be calling for. But can you understand our concerns… Frustrations… Disappointment? They have a captive audience here… Several thousand aviation enthusiasts, and they issue that? Any press office worth it’s weight would have targeted their press releases to hit with maximum impact. Yet they’re way off the mark and the whole thing once again looks bad on TVOC… All because (IMHO) they haven’t thought through what they’re doing before they do it.
If TVOC are going to post something on here, then have a read through what is already being said, and issue a press release that will put to bed some of those rumours. There are only weeks to go, and we’re being told to wait for updates?
Please, I understand your passion for this project… I think we all do, but can you see how the people in charge of this operation are undoing all the good work that so many people (and perhaps none more so than you and Mr T) have done to get 558 back in the air. Time is so short, and yet we’re being given that drizzle.
Rather than come on here with lousy press releases, why not some one here and answer a few questions and try to get us handing over our money once more…. One things for sure… Statements like the one posted yesterday don’t do anything to alleviate peoples concerns over the future of 558.
VX927😮 😮 I cant believe it! 😮 😮
558 Press Office. Well done. I hope you’ll forgive me for saying that you’re about 3 years late, but it’s better late than never.
I presume that you are someone with a position of authority within TVOC? With that in mind, would you also be able to give feedback to people who have ideas on how to raise funds or improve the overall profile of 558 / TVOC?
I must say it is of concern that in just over 4 weeks, you only raised £200,000. I know that is a great achievement, but it’s clearly nothing like enough if you need £1,000,000 by the end of January?
Thanks for what I hope is the first of many updates.
VX927Isn’t this what the current pledge scheme running since the beginning of December is? If they are not confident the target figure can be reach no-one is asked to part with their money
So it is. This isn’t a criticism but a genuine comment. TVOC, perhaps you need to advertise that point a bit more. Classic case isn’t it… I didn’t even read that. Why? Because it looks like just another request for money. And the radio broadcast I heard certainly didn’t make any reference to it .
Well, I’m a man of my word, so I’ll sign up to that.
But it still doesn’t address the bigger issues with the company.
I’d still really like a signed print for the wall!… And there must be loads of old 558 Skin laying about after all the new work that was carried out? Cut it up like they did with the Lancaster spar and sell it! People have made thousands of pounds doing just that kind of thing… Why aren’t TVOC doing that?
VX927i feel that the situation will be similar to the situation concerning various governmental parties coming to power, difficult to make a footing when so much criticism is awarded based on your predecessors actions?
just my 10pence
A valid point, but it is also an opportunity to wipe the slate clean, and perhaps in vigour a bit of energy back in the project. I don’t know. I just find the whole thing so frustrating. I think perhaps the TVOC guys need a team day out. I suggest the jump in the mini bus and drive all of about 200yds to see the Lightning boys at Bruntingthorpe. I’m sure 320 would be glad to show them around?!!!! Then they would see what can be achieved when you put your mind to it. You don’t just keep asking for money, and threatening to ground the aircraft. You have to give something in return. There must be so many things that they could do to raise money. How many of us have a signed Squadron Print (or any other print / paining for that matter)??? Can you believe, I’ve searched TVOC’s web site and cant find a print for sale signed by the flight crew for 2008… In fact, I cant see any prints signed or unsigned on there. This is the point. This is why I say that it’s time for change. It’s easy to single out those who have left but Rusty… Wasn’t she the merchandise manager? Merchandise, and she hasn’t sorted out a signed print? Yes, you can buy a nice wine stopper, or a mobile phone holder, but you cant buy a signed print?
You know, I genuinely believe that there are people on this forum who could do a better job than some of those who are in power at TVOC.
This isn’t meant to be a personal attack on anyone, and I don’t mean to single out Rusty, but the reality is that if the project is so close to stalling, then why don’t they try and do something pro active rather than just going on the radio asking for money. Why don’t they come on here, issue a statement and put all these rumours to bed once I and for all (if in fact they are only rumours). Why don’t they come on here and make a personal plea?
I have one final suggestion… TVOC, if you’re reading this. Why not set up a system for the next couple of months where by you set a target, and then ask for money. They money donated is held by a 3rd party until such time as that target is reached. If it’s not reached then people GET THEIR MONEY BACK. If it is reached, then great… 558 is secure for another year. There is one BIG advantage to this. A lot of people no longer donate to the project because they don’t think that they will see a return, or they are concerned that their money is being flittered away. I mean, if £1million is what you need and people donate £600,000 then what happens/ their good donation is spent paying wages, debts etc, and still 558 doesn’t fly. People just wont keep giving in that scenario. Where is if there was some security to that donation, then they may think twice. I certainly wont be giving any more money in the current situation, but I would donate again if something like this was in place.
I know this is falling on deaf ears… I know nothing will change… But I can live in hope.
VX927and there are those that think that Dr Pleming isnt worth the money……
I’m not sure if I’d say he’s not worth the money, but I do feel that it’s time for him to hand over the reins. The fact of the matter is that he’s not delivering on what he set out to do. Yes, the Vulcan has one season behind her, but she was supposed to be with us flying for 10 years… And we’re now being told that the magic £1million has to arrive by the end of the month, or it’s game over for 558. They promised sponsorship which hasn’t been forthcoming. Now that may not be Dr Plemings fault, but the fact is, he hasn’t been able to deliver on the operational side of the Vulcan (IMHO), and I think he should step aside and let someone else take the reins. Perhaps Mr Thomas should take over now that he’s stepped down as chief pilot?
VX927I just thought it would be nice to have a dedicated vehicle (thread) where all the like minded souls who actually applaud XH558 and her support teams efforts could discuss and bathe in the delight of their understated achievements over the past years.
Andy, who on this forum doesn’t applaud the team on the achievement of getting 558 back in the sky?
Highlighting the short comings of TVOC doesn’t mean that we dont applaud what has been achieved. The sad part is that if only TVOC would take on board some of the points that are being raised then the vulcan may not be in the mess it’s in now. I’m not saying that every idea posted on here is a great one, but the current system clearly isn’t working and it has to be time for change? With 1 month to go before 558 is grounded for good (TVOC not me!) I’d say it’s time for a radical change of plan…
VX927Chox
Can you explain how they accomplish getting 558 and all her required bits and pieces to the states? and why are you so hung up about her going over there?
She could fly there quite easily, and a chartered 124 should sort out all the ‘bits and pieces’. If she went to the NTPS, then, then perhaps the 124 could be replaced with a C17 or C5 out of Mildenhall… To be honest, I dont think it would be that difficult to achieve. I know I’m answering on Chox’s behalf, but Bubbles, if you go back and read through what Chox has written, then it’s blatantly obvious why he’d like to see her heading west. You many not agree with it (and nor do I), but to answer your question, go back and read Chox’s posts…
VX927WZ 706. Hitching a lift on a low loader from Middle Wallop to Devon to be put back in flying condition, hopefully for late spring 2009.
Is this the AOP9 that was in store in the Historic Flights hangar? Has she been sold, or is just going to Devon for restoration,. and then returning back to Wallop
VX927I hear they’re on the local radio again asking for £1million by the end of January!
VX927Would anyone have any idea what the current scrap value of one of these aircraft would be? Perhapse a better question would be whats the empty weight (presumably minus engines?).
VX927VX, would you be happy to see her in a semi cut up state? If so I’ll get images scanned and posted (it might be after Christmas now though)
C6
Hello Circus,
Yes please… I would be very interested to see the images. I remember the day she was being cut up, I was at Marham being shown around XL164 (Saucy Sal). I remember the visit well, it was towards the end of the Victors time in service, and there was a film crew at Marham filming the Victors.
Nice to see that 164’s cockpit survived… Is it still at Gatwick?
VX927As someone that was living near Waddington until quite recently, let me correct you all.
XL189 was the gate guard and it was still in the old camo scheme when it was scrapped in 89, the airframe that arrived with an onboard fire was XH669 and it was painted in the Hemp colour scheme and after sometime in the hangers for investigation (presumably) and after spares recovery it went onto the dump.
Tim S
Thats the one Tim! I remember my father telling me that a Victor had come in with a fire, and I remember seeing her on my occasions.
I was starting to question myself with all this talk of XL189, because we were still in Scotland when she arrived at Waddington, and I was sure that the Victor I’d seen here was painted in hemp. Does anyone have any photos of her.
Thank you for all the replies.
VX927So which of you guys is qualified in accountancy or Aero engineering or commercial sponsorship then?
Normally I wouldn’t comment on an ill informed thread like this but the damage you and others do to the creditability of aircraft restoration is mind boggling.
A salary of £100k buys you a mediocre fund raiser/project manager (so £60k is cheep!) – if you don’t know that basic fact don’t even comment on this project. If you don’t appreciate the real world cost or have an understanding of the figures in an accounts return forget it because the real world players realise how silly you look.
Bruce has tactfully pointed you in to thinking about these issues, you haven’t picked up the nuances so I have now spelt it out.
Merry Christmas
Merry Christmas to you too Chris,
I’m not a qualified accountant, but really, you dont need to be a qualified accountant to work this out. The figures that are quoited by TVOC just dont add up. People talk about what a great Job Pleming has done. Well I’m sorry, but I dont see it. Maybe I’m blind to it, but as I remember Bruce pointing out many moons ago, The physical engineering behind getting 558 back in the sky wasn’t that hard part. The aircraft was intact, the knowledge was there and the relevant authorities were on side. The hard part was two fold. First securing the money to return her to flight. I understand that there are still outstanding debts from the restoration so on that account one could be harsh and say they have failed. But the bigger task was securing the future of 558. And yet after only it’s first season back on the display circuit 558’s future is very much in doubt. We have CONSTANTLY been lied to about things, particularly the sponsorship issue, and I do genuinely think that it sucks.
Interesting that you think the damage caused by my comments is mind boggling. if any damage is being caused it isn’t as a result of my comments, but is a result of TVOC who have taken millions of pounds of the public’s money to restore an aircaft which now sits in a hangar like a stranded whale in a harbour
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