SmithNola Luxford
New Zealand actress Nola Luxford was the driving force behind the ANZAC Club in NYC – this club entertained some 35,000 ANZAC (AUS and NZ) personnel in WWII.
http://bulletin.ninemsn.com.au/bulletin/eddesk.nsf/printing/CAE478044D067BE7CA256A33001BCF23
Dave FYI, the guy in the centre background of this photo (over Nola’s LH shoulder as you look at her, has a moustache) is my Uncle Lloyd English who subsequently died at Peenemunde!
SmithOne of the world’s most remarkable artists – Colin McCahon http://www.mccahon.co.nz/browse.asp
SmithOne of the world’s most remarkable artists – Colin McCahon http://www.mccahon.co.nz/browse.asp
SmithBloody hell Dave – you forgot to mention …. ah, ermmm … what was it now? :p
SmithBloody hell Dave – you forgot to mention …. ah, ermmm … what was it now? :p
SmithAh Dave – nuclear free. We used to be in ANZUS (a joint US, Australia, New Zealand defence thingy). Not now. Don’t like them nukes. And for a while there didn’t like them Frogs either – blowing up islands in our backyard so to speak – not to mention the “Rainbow Warrior”. Look it up CB.
SmithAh Dave – nuclear free. We used to be in ANZUS (a joint US, Australia, New Zealand defence thingy). Not now. Don’t like them nukes. And for a while there didn’t like them Frogs either – blowing up islands in our backyard so to speak – not to mention the “Rainbow Warrior”. Look it up CB.
SmithWhat is New Zealand?
I am a Kiwi past and present, and I’ve spent many years travelling to and living in other parts of the Globe … and recently decided to return “home” for reasons not yet 100% clear (something about home is where your friends are, something like that).
This is just a brain-dump – a rant of sorts.
First – we’re Kiwis – the Kiwi is a national emblem (along with the Silver Fern) and everyone here is a “Kiwi”. It’s a fairly rare, small, nocturnal, flightless bird and quite why it’s become the national identity beats me – perhaps that’s something to look up CB?
We’re also grappling with a broad national issue called bi-culturalism. This stems from being one of the few (maybe only) places in the world to have been formed with a treaty between the would-be colonialists (primarily UK persons) and the indigenous natives. The treaty provided for the protection of Maori interests by the Crown. That has since broken down into an unwinnable argument about how far those interests extend – and this bizarre situation where we endeavour to enact bi-culturalism. Maori and Pakeha (where Pakeha is non-Maori, white etc). Difficulty then becomes how to fit in other cultures, especially the large contingents of Asian and Pacific Island people. The latter are Pacifica, the former indeterminate.
By way of contrast, Australia favours multi-culturalism and for example when/if you become an Australian citizen you are asked to retain your existing identity, contribute it into the melting pot that is Australia and add being an “Australian” to your self view. It is an interesting and powerful approach and New Zealand would be the better for a similar perspective.
Just on that Australia/New Zealand theme. It’s like big brother, little brother. Forever squabbling and trying to best each other in every endeavour (the pavlova debate is an example), but if you hit one of them you just hit the family. ANZAC! Do read Andy-in-beds ANZAC thread on historic for a sense of what that means. And CER (Closer Economic Relations) – this is a treaty between NZ and AU along the lines of NAFTA I should think. You can get a T shirt here “I support two teams, New Zealand and anyone else playing Australia”. But take any Aussie or Kiwi to the other country and you’ll find the opposite is true. The similar context for a North American audience is Canada vs USA.
Process ~ there’s a Kiwi concept “number 8 wire” (a fencing product I think), it’s about the idea that things can be fixed with simple tools/materials and ingenuity. It tends to reveal itself in the national character as a way of getting things done. “To hell with your process, what do want done? Oh that, easy – we’ll cut this corner, miss that step out and bingo, here it is – done!” It’s one of the major differences vis-a-vis Australia. In Australia process is king – do it this way or else! It reveals itself as NZ getting things done quicker and cheaper and Australia getting them done better (in due course).
Myths and Legends – Maori legends and stories add immense depth to the NZ experience. For example the wonderful story or the 5 mountains in the middle of the North Island (Ngaruahoe, Ruapehu, Tongariro, Taranaki and Tarawera. The latter two had a tiff of some sort so the other 3 sent them packing in different directions. Look at a map and you’ll see that the first three are (still) in the middle of the island but Taranaki is at the western tip and Tarawera far to the East.
Maori BTW arrived here about 1000 years ago – they migrated from Hawaiki (ancient Hawaii) in remakable voyages atop large ocean going canoes and are therefore related to many other Pacific cultures.
NZ is a young country geographically – so it is still active (Volcanoes and Earthquakes). It is the far eastern part of ancient Gondwanaland – Australia is the major component and Indonesia, Malaysia etc. the northern elements.
NZ is about as big as the UK but population only 4 million or so. Only one large city (Auckland at 1+ million). Major economic driver is farming. And lots of lovely things to look at = tourism – also a major economic driver. Both are constrained by distance. We’re a hell of a long way from everywhere else (except Australia).
Lots of good wine – some great wine (primarily Sauvingon Blanc and Pinot Noir).
Temperate climate, most of the country not very hot or very cold. But there are exceptions – very mild winters in the North and cold in the South – where there are also many mountains = lots of skiing.
Enough – I need to do some work (arrgh, the mighty dollar!). Have a look here …
http://www.tourism.net.nz/
http://www.jasons.co.nz/
http://www.maori.org.nz/
http://www.doc.govt.nz/Explore/001~National-Parks/Tongariro-National-Park/index.asp
SmithWhat is New Zealand?
I am a Kiwi past and present, and I’ve spent many years travelling to and living in other parts of the Globe … and recently decided to return “home” for reasons not yet 100% clear (something about home is where your friends are, something like that).
This is just a brain-dump – a rant of sorts.
First – we’re Kiwis – the Kiwi is a national emblem (along with the Silver Fern) and everyone here is a “Kiwi”. It’s a fairly rare, small, nocturnal, flightless bird and quite why it’s become the national identity beats me – perhaps that’s something to look up CB?
We’re also grappling with a broad national issue called bi-culturalism. This stems from being one of the few (maybe only) places in the world to have been formed with a treaty between the would-be colonialists (primarily UK persons) and the indigenous natives. The treaty provided for the protection of Maori interests by the Crown. That has since broken down into an unwinnable argument about how far those interests extend – and this bizarre situation where we endeavour to enact bi-culturalism. Maori and Pakeha (where Pakeha is non-Maori, white etc). Difficulty then becomes how to fit in other cultures, especially the large contingents of Asian and Pacific Island people. The latter are Pacifica, the former indeterminate.
By way of contrast, Australia favours multi-culturalism and for example when/if you become an Australian citizen you are asked to retain your existing identity, contribute it into the melting pot that is Australia and add being an “Australian” to your self view. It is an interesting and powerful approach and New Zealand would be the better for a similar perspective.
Just on that Australia/New Zealand theme. It’s like big brother, little brother. Forever squabbling and trying to best each other in every endeavour (the pavlova debate is an example), but if you hit one of them you just hit the family. ANZAC! Do read Andy-in-beds ANZAC thread on historic for a sense of what that means. And CER (Closer Economic Relations) – this is a treaty between NZ and AU along the lines of NAFTA I should think. You can get a T shirt here “I support two teams, New Zealand and anyone else playing Australia”. But take any Aussie or Kiwi to the other country and you’ll find the opposite is true. The similar context for a North American audience is Canada vs USA.
Process ~ there’s a Kiwi concept “number 8 wire” (a fencing product I think), it’s about the idea that things can be fixed with simple tools/materials and ingenuity. It tends to reveal itself in the national character as a way of getting things done. “To hell with your process, what do want done? Oh that, easy – we’ll cut this corner, miss that step out and bingo, here it is – done!” It’s one of the major differences vis-a-vis Australia. In Australia process is king – do it this way or else! It reveals itself as NZ getting things done quicker and cheaper and Australia getting them done better (in due course).
Myths and Legends – Maori legends and stories add immense depth to the NZ experience. For example the wonderful story or the 5 mountains in the middle of the North Island (Ngaruahoe, Ruapehu, Tongariro, Taranaki and Tarawera. The latter two had a tiff of some sort so the other 3 sent them packing in different directions. Look at a map and you’ll see that the first three are (still) in the middle of the island but Taranaki is at the western tip and Tarawera far to the East.
Maori BTW arrived here about 1000 years ago – they migrated from Hawaiki (ancient Hawaii) in remakable voyages atop large ocean going canoes and are therefore related to many other Pacific cultures.
NZ is a young country geographically – so it is still active (Volcanoes and Earthquakes). It is the far eastern part of ancient Gondwanaland – Australia is the major component and Indonesia, Malaysia etc. the northern elements.
NZ is about as big as the UK but population only 4 million or so. Only one large city (Auckland at 1+ million). Major economic driver is farming. And lots of lovely things to look at = tourism – also a major economic driver. Both are constrained by distance. We’re a hell of a long way from everywhere else (except Australia).
Lots of good wine – some great wine (primarily Sauvingon Blanc and Pinot Noir).
Temperate climate, most of the country not very hot or very cold. But there are exceptions – very mild winters in the North and cold in the South – where there are also many mountains = lots of skiing.
Enough – I need to do some work (arrgh, the mighty dollar!). Have a look here …
http://www.tourism.net.nz/
http://www.jasons.co.nz/
http://www.maori.org.nz/
http://www.doc.govt.nz/Explore/001~National-Parks/Tongariro-National-Park/index.asp
SmithDog House Ldr – it’s more than possible that Roger Freeman’s Mighty Eigth War Diaries will provide you with good information – someone here will have a copy at hand.
There’s also an online chronology of USAAF operations here …
http://paul.rutgers.edu/~mcgrew/wwii/usaf/html/Apr.44.html
For that date, mission 323 it provides this generic information – good background for your specific request
EUROPEAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS (ETO)
STRATEGIC OPERATIONS (Eighth Air Force)
Mission 323: 486 bombers and 543 fighters are dispatched to bomb airfields, marshalling yards and targets of opportunity in France and Belgium; 4 bombers and 4 fighters are lost.
1. 168 B-17s are dispatched to bomb Nancy/Essay Airfield (103 bomb) and Toul/Croix de Metz landing ground (60 bomb), France; 2 B-17s are lost and 33 damaged; 20 airmen are MIA.
2. Of 120 B-17s, 98 bomb Le Culot Airfield and 20 bomb Ostend/Middelkerke Airfield, Belgium; 2 B-17s are lost and 29 damaged; 1 airman is KIA and 20 MIA.
3. Of 198 B-24s, 118 bomb Blainville sur L’eau marshalling yard and 72 bomb Chalons sur Marne marshalling yard, France; 2 B-24s are damaged beyond repair and 22 damaged; casualties are 24 KIA, 6 WIA and 1 MIA.
Escort is provided by 106 P-38s, 283 P-47s and 154 P-51s; the fighters claim 3-0-1 Luftwaffe aircraft in the air and 4-0-5 on the ground; 4 P-47s are lost and 2 P-47s and 1 P-51 are damaged; 3 airmen are MIA.
SmithIs that not the same supplier Blue Robin? Clicks through to the same place, are you saying there’s a margin in there?
SmithJDK – I take it you’re saying the lack of priority accorded the HE219 cannot be seen as an endorsement, even implicit, of the BF110. Interesting, and on reflection I think maybe I have encountered that argument before. You may be right.
All the same, I do think the 110 was a good nightfighter, particularly after shrage musik was fitted.
As for the HE219, it was a formidable weapon and I would argue is not a candidate for the label “underrated”, but is nevertheless often overlooked.
SmithExcellent post PhantomII – and indicative of the value of this forum where well researched opinion flourishes in abundance.
I agree with you and Mark that the Hurricane is also generally underrated, although I think you will find it is not underrated here.
And I agree with you re. the BF-110. The 110 was an excellent gun platform and came into its own as a superb make-do night fighter, eclipsed only by the HE 219 which was never accorded manufacturing priority over the 110 (due to the view the tradeoff of significant production disruption was not warranted – ie. the 110 was more than adequate in the circumstances).
Don
SmithSmithLove to – cheers D
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