I am pretty sure we have discussed this briefly at time
you got it 180 degree wrong, gripen/rafale are always controllable at very high AoA, and safe to operate at high AoA.
Nice read, thanks.
Keep the focus on the threat:
Uber G is the last thing you’ll need going WVR with this.
it’s difficult to say but the increase in chord length at the root suggest less induced drag hence more available power, hence less drag. All converge toward the increased ceiling.
FlightGlobal report 5 test airframe in the RFP and 3 LRIP lots. This is a great favor to all with a new design or willing to profoundly recapitalize their offer with added features.
US Air Force releases final T-X trainer RFP
The $16.3 billion RFP encompasses a total of 350 aircraft, including delivery of the initial five test aircraft, contract options for LRIP lots 1 and 2 and full-rate production of lots 3 through 11.
Leonardo-Finmeccanica: successful first flight for the new Aermacchi M-345
http://www.leonardocompany.com/en/-/leonardo-m346-primo-volo-first-flight
Life cycle cost reduction is driven by long fatigue and two-level maintenance, the latter made possible by replacing the expensive general overhauls with the airframe and systems Health and Usage Monitoring System (HUMS).
Definitively, an advantage for Metal airframe in long term fleet management and budget planing.
Tomcat VIP claimed that none of the 4th gen aircraft (basically, none bar the F-22, would be able to pull up like the F-35 did.. especially deltas who’d depart controlled flight and whatnot… fact is, not only they can pull straight up (and more), but they can do it from a much lower speed than what you’ll need to have the F-35 in the air…
In theory, Delta have inherently suitable high AoA characteristics as they are flown at higher angle to generate lift. However they suffer from pitch up involuntary departure (I mentioned the Draken pilots training). So, in fact, FBW will prevent a fighter pilot to do such manoevre and will restrict him in the open flight domain, <28 deg for the 2K and more or less 35 for a Rafale (from my own mem – feel free to get the exact on available doc).
As demo’d much earlier, canards configuration add their share of restrictions in yaw, limiting roll rate at low speed (high AoA) and, obviously rudder travel (down to zero).
Again this is well known today.
No I haven’t, I have just watched the video and I saw your unrealistic comment.
I usually like to respond to more serious posters when I have the time, but now I have dilemma if I did the right thing.I know that F-35 is superior when we talk about high AoA maneuverability, I even stressed out that in my previous post. But, what that has to do with the video in question and to what I have said?
What is with the ******* ?
Can you translate that to me?Yes I did, and I tried thoroughly to explain what is happening. Basically the plane started to climb at relatively slow speed. Nothing other 4th generation planes can’t do. If you have some other explanation I will be happy to hear.
So, we have the video with F-35 and F-16 flying in formation side by side at the same cruise speed and “her” speed (I’m assuming by “her” you are referring to F-35) is somehow superior? What are you talking about?
All I can see is that F-35 pilots field of view is more obstructed compared to F-16 because it flies at much higher AoA. Consequently the plane produces more drag and has to increase power to stay at the same speed as F-16 leading to greater fuel comsumption.I don’t have any idea what are you are talking about here and if it doesn’t have anything to do with the video in question I don’t care.
How is this related to what I have said?
Again, how is this related to what I have said and based on what are you claiming that what F-35 did in the video no other 4th generation plane can do?
How did you just by watching that video concluded anything about “her” superiority over any other 4th generation fighter?
Posturing… not replying.
Aircraft: is it a She or a It?
Already. yes. You’re not going to try to sell twice the Eiffel tower, don’t you?
From my point of view this video shows that F-35 needs much higher AoA to stay in the formation with F-16 at that particular (low) speed, nothing more nothing less. Negative effect [blablabla]
What I find ironically is that the pilots are mostly talking about F-35 high AoA maneuverability and the benefits it provides during WVR combat compared to F-16, but at the same time most of the western pilots are bashing russian planes with much superior high AoA capabilities.
Frankly Peregrinefalcon, I don’t even know if you had taken the time to read the discussion from its beginning and if I should loose time replying.
Just to be brief:
– The official max AoA of the F16 is well known to be around 28 deg
– The official max AoA of the F35 is well known to be around 50 deg
What the ******* is all this digression of your? Didn’t you even bother to watch the last 10 sec of the video?
As said before there are two ways to see the superior F35 AoA while flying in formation:
– her cruise speed is superior (what we know from the inception of the prog)
– her lift management is different.
A well designed cruise missile for example will use bodylift for low speed and wing lift for high speed (the fuselage attitude being then around the Cl0).
The F35 could well use the same principle. This would explain the more severe attitude at low speed and the positive pitch of the elevator (to be explained perhaps one day).
IAF would prefer to have to Rafale beyond 36 under Make in India Category in terms of Fleet Management and Capability , Rafale is ideal aircraft chief states but cost is high Air Chief states
http://www.ndtv.com/video/shows/walk-the-talk/walk-the-talk-with-air-chief-marshal-arup-raha-443840
But again what’s the rational? What is Dassault’s official pitch on this one? What are the perspectives for India ? You can’t offer local shared production of Falcon’s and Rafale when the production rate is so low. They will have to articulate something with an European partner (Safran, Thales etc…) when those ones are already engaged following the earlier deal for 36 airframe.
2015 for the airframer [represent] with 55 deliveries its lowest figure for 10 years [(Falcons)].
Boeing and LM communication on the contrary are well rounded and the difference is so stricking that many can only share VNomad’s opinion given the past events. They have to come full frontal with the public on another way than brutish Bollywood like lobbying . Powerpoint is sexy sometimes 😉
Source:
FlightGlobal.com
oreign F-16s getting better data links
MIDS-LVT is designed to provide Link 16 capability at a lower weight, volume and cost. MIDS-LVT features real-time data communications, situational awareness and navigation, digital voice and TACAN in a jam-resistant, crypto-secured package.
Where is the evidence that the performance gap are huge? do you have any chart to show ? Nope. Do you have any video to show ?
Actually, as said before, the video shows a huge gap in performance… in favor of the F35. None of 4th Gen or 4++Gen can do this. The best inline so far, the SH with its massive AoA advantage among its peer at 50deg, has never been seen doing such.