HP57You could have been talking about, P-39, Hawk 75 and a certain Bristol type thing, just to mention a few! Always good to have a volunteer.
Getting the Halifax cockpit structure built.
Cees
HP57Isn’t it always the the thing that happens? 😀 Still as I recall one answer you got over at HS suggested yellow (stands out inf the dark). One thing – I don’t think they’d be is red – that colour disappears completely in the dark.
Of course you could always hinge the escape hatch then when the real answer emerges you could repaint it. 😉
Just spotted this thread,
Phil, use yellow, at least that colour is quoted in the drawings I have of the pilot’s escape hatch.
Cheers
Cees
HP57Regarding the buried MkV Halifax, the information was passed on by a leading member of a Halifax appreciation / action group – someone whose helped so many organisations regarding this aircraft type. I doubt he would tell a porky. He did tell me the site was difficult to access due to the owners (possibly foreign). There may also be toxic waste buried on the site. Also, the site flooded a few years ago. That’s all I know. I guess someone could find out which MkVs were written off on take off from a factory site or such other.
Phillip,
What a lot of bad luck to happen on the same site where a priceless Halifax is buried :rolleyes:
I talked to you-know-who last evening and he laughed his head off when I told him your story 😉
Cheers
Cees
HP57The trouble with this forum
😡 😡 The problems with certain moderators have been with us for some time now and has caused several contributors to go elsewhere, which is the loss of the forum. The best moderator has left us as of January 1st. And we have regularly been suffering from ignorant members. Of course this is a public forum and everyone has a right to give his opinion but lately the quality of this forum has been on the decline and it makes it less enjoyable to participate or even check the various topics on a daily basis.
I would like to point out that if things are not reversed the forum will be a childish playground and the really good topics will diminish or dissapear altogether as well as some of the regular contributors.
My opinion only of course
Cheers
Cees
HP57The trouble with this forum
😡 😡 The problems with certain moderators have been with us for some time now and has caused several contributors to go elsewhere, which is the loss of the forum. The best moderator has left us as of January 1st. And we have regularly been suffering from ignorant members. Of course this is a public forum and everyone has a right to give his opinion but lately the quality of this forum has been on the decline and it makes it less enjoyable to participate or even check the various topics on a daily basis.
I would like to point out that if things are not reversed the forum will be a childish playground and the really good topics will diminish or dissapear altogether as well as some of the regular contributors.
My opinion only of course
Cheers
Cees
HP57I’m sure most of these stories are just stories, but what is “dangerous” soil? Would this be a marshy area or something?
Yest, it is.
But sticking to the topic, there must be more substantial Whitley remains on high ground sites. Elliott, care to enlighten us?
Cheers
Cees
HP57There’s a Halifax in a lake near Berlin – complete with bomb load and the crew survived. There is also a MkV Halifax buried in the UK. The pilot retracted the U/C too soon and he skidded along the runway before ending up in a field. The aircraft had just been serviced. I understand they stripped it clean then dumped it into a pit (made when they were filling sandbags). It was later buried. Now the chap who told me this is well known to a lot of people and he isn’t the kind of person who would I believe spread such rumours (I Hope). He won’t tell me where the aircraft is buried, but the site has not been built upon and during the war the airfield was used to refurbish Halifax aircraft.
Regarding those aircraft which ditched. We know roughly where hundreds ditch (through ORBs). We also know which areas are more likely to keep an aircraft intact. Survey work is expensive, but if you just sonar scan, you’d know through searching this way, which sites were prime for further investigating (ROV or divers). The problem is in securing a really good scanner.
You know, what really pisses me off. Assholes who win the lottery (or those who don’t claim their winnings). Not one lottery winner I know has a keen interest in our aerodrome or aviation heritage. As some of you know I’m keen to see former RAF Driffield preserved and guest who won £18m last year on the lottery – some TESCO workers from Driffield. I bought my last lottery ticket on New Year’s Eve. You can tell I’m bitter.
AND ANOTHER THING…
Oh, I got distracted – where was I????
Philip,
There is NO Mk V Halifax buried lying there to be recovered. If so it would have been recovered decades ago. There is a Halifax wreck that went into soft ground but the soil is too dangerous to get near.
Oh, and of course the chap doesn’t want to tell you where it is, because it’s just not there.
Cheers
Cees
HP57How long can an aircraft survive in deep fresh water?
Maybe in years to come, when technology and recovery techniques have improved aircraft could be recovered cheaply and easily.
Imagine, 100 years from now…. a stirling from the deep!
Easy!!!!, cheap!!! have you been drinking too much warm milk?
Aircraft recovery is never easy nor cheap, determination is the difficult part the rest is the easy bit (where there is a will….. look at Halifaxes NA337 and W1048, and the Fw200 Kondor, mmm in the same fjord a ….. ditched as well 😉 and the Lake Michigan recoveries).
A Stirling in 100 years time, better make it within 10 years otherwise it has been reduced to dust.
Be realistic, make a plan, find the right persons (Dacon for instance) get the funding and the rest will happen (if you MAKE it happen, dreamers will get nowhere).
Oh, remember the two recent Norwegian recoveries of the Heinkel III and the Junkers 88. What a treasure trove still lies in the Scandinavian lakes. Some of us on this board know more 😎
Cees
HP57My thoughts…
WOW, a Whitley…
True, I think a lot more could be done to survey the bottom of our seas. According to Flypast the Americans are thinking about recovering a lost Clipper (quick someone help me out with a name). True, surveying can be expensive, but depending on how you go about it, you could end up with a list of suitable aircraft wrecks to recover. I would imagine that most smaller boats can easily be fitted with sonar, while an ROV will make the need for a diver (very expensive) almost not needed. The thing is you know the Royal Navy and other Navies probably know where the best wrecks are, as they scan the bottom of most seas, anyway.
I would scan the fresh water lakes first, beginning with Norwegian fjords.
There must be another Halifax lurking somewhere (a mk II)
Cheers
Cees
HP57>I was also informed that HFL is going to modify their Burmese Spitfire project into a two-seater<
The operative word is MAY modify into a two seater!
Not set in concrete yet.Best to all of you for ’06
MM
Not another one please
Cees
HP57We dont intend on flying our Lancaster at all. However there is still a very small chance that another lanc may possibly take to the skies once again…….
Which is ………………
Come Peter, don’t keep us in suspense any longer? :p
Cees
HP57Right, a little digging and from the Bomber Command losses 1941 by WR Chorley we get;
November 8/1941
49 Squadron Hampden I P1206 EA-K
Op: IntruderTook off 1714 Scampton on an intruder sortie in the Bocholt area. Shot down by a night fighter and crashed at 2107 into the Ijsselmeer. Both pilots are buried in Bergen general cemetery: their crew have no known graves.
W/O C A Saunders DFM +
Sgt. J M D’Arcy +
Sgt. S G Mullenger +
Sgt. J E Kehoe +MULLENGER, STANLEY GORDON
Initials: S G
Nationality: United Kingdom
Rank: Sergeant
Regiment: Royal Air Force Volunteer Reserve
Unit Text: 49 Sqdn.
Date of Death: 08/11/1941
Service No: 1251152
Casualty Type: Commonwealth War Dead
Grave/Memorial Reference: Panel 49.
Cemetery: RUNNYMEDE MEMORIALSAUNDERS, CHRISTOPHER ARTHUR
Initials: C A
Nationality: United Kingdom
Rank: Warrant Officer (Pilot)
Regiment: Royal Air Force
Unit Text: 49 Sqdn.
Age: 28
Date of Death: 08/11/1941
Service No: 562617
Awards: DFM
Additional information: Son of Henry Robert and Gertrude Saunders; husband of Frances Evelyn Saunders, of Morden, Surrey.
Casualty Type: Commonwealth War Dead
Grave/Memorial Reference: Plot 1. Row E. Grave 27.
Cemetery: BERGEN GENERAL CEMETERYD’ARCY, JAMES MARCUS
Initials: J M
Nationality: United Kingdom
Rank: Sergeant (Pilot)
Regiment: Royal Air Force Volunteer Reserve
Unit Text: 49 Sqdn.
Age: 26
Date of Death: 08/11/1941
Service No: 1288762
Additional information: Son of M. H. and Maude D’Arcy, of Halkyn, Flintshire.
Casualty Type: Commonwealth War Dead
Grave/Memorial Reference: Plot 1. Row E. Grave 28.
Cemetery: BERGEN GENERAL CEMETERYKEHOE, JOHN EDWARD
Initials: J E
Nationality: United Kingdom
Rank: Sergeant
Regiment: Royal Air Force
Unit Text: 49 Sqdn.
Age: 20
Date of Death: 08/11/1941
Service No: 551389
Additional information: Son of Edward and Ellen Kehoe, of New Ross, Co. Wexford, Republic of Ireland.
Casualty Type: Commonwealth War Dead
Grave/Memorial Reference: Panel 46.
Cemetery: RUNNYMEDE MEMORIALAlthough the family are adamant that they were shown a wooden cross marking the spot where the plane crashed and that that is on the land of a Mr.Schilder and not in a river, an alternative version has it sinking deep into marshy ground.
You guessed it
Cheers
Cees
HP57Forgot 2, how could I.
Does Mark know about these Spitfire shots?
Cees
HP57Nope, C-87 transport version
Cheers
Cees
HP57During the investigation of Whitley V N1521 we found the Rotol spinner badge. It was a surprise find as it was completely embeded in a block of clay of the bottom of the lake the aircraft crashed in. No trace of the spinners but just the one badge, remarkable.
Cheers
Cees
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