oh well what do I know, I’ve only had eight cats:rolleyes:

Another good way of stopping cats from using your garden as the local toilet is to try befriending them – give ’em food and be nice to ’em… cats generally don’t like cr*pping on their own doorsteps so if they regard your garden as friendly territory, they might go off and do it someplace else. Doesn’t always work but it often does.

Glad you mentioned that Tim – think we were talking about two aircraft at the same time!

Ahh, remember the poor ol’ Vulcan on the dump in that ghastly green paint?

You’ve completely lost me there! If you mean that I get embroiled in arguments with people then yes that’s true, but then as you know, there’s an awful lot of people on the internet that talk a load of rubbish!

Re- the Victor, I’m not saying anything that isn’t true – and I would imagine most people would agree with me, particularly on a site such as this one? Wouldn’t you love to tell the person responsible for the ridiculous “gate guard” ruling precisely what you thought of him? I know I would!

A very sad victim of the stupid “one exhibit per station” rule that some idiot invented for no reason, back then.

Nobody ever worked-out why there was any need to restrict static exhibits to one aircraft or why anyone felt compelled to dictate such rules for every base, but I guess there’s always some fool that screws things up for everybody else. Pity that such people couldn’t use their time to do something more productive, rather than simply destroy valued pieces of history.

the CAA have said that only crew and the crewchief is allowed up there

…and this is where I came in:p

Naturally, access to Bruntingthorpe and the actual aircraft could be much more relaxed if it wasn’t for the rules and regulations that have dogged the project from the start. At some point, safety becomes suffocation and it’s my belief that we’ve gone way past that stage already in this country.

On a wider point, I have to say that I’m really not convinced that donations will ever keep XH558 flying. Even under the best of circumstances I don’t think there will ever be enough money from this source to finance such an expensive exercise. Pleming has always claimed that there would be but I think the experience of the past couple of years shows that there just isn’t. My view is that unless the HLF can be persuaded (or at least asked – that would be a start!) to donate more money to a project which they’ve already allocated a huge amount of money to, the aircraft has only a very short future ahead, and it would be far better to take her to the US where, even if no funding can be found, she would survive in better condition for longer.

My fear however, is that Pleming and TVOC have no intention of even thinking about either option. I get the impression that Pleming will carry-on down the same path until the donations dry-up (and therefore his salary as well) and he’ll simply walk away. I’d love to be proved wrong but we’ll see…

Well to be as clear as I can, I have no axe to grind. As I’ve said repeatedly, I’ve tried to help when I can but TVOC’s communication skills are, as anyone will tell you, rubbish. Whether this is by accident or design I don’t know. I’ve supported TVOC’s efforts for a long, long time despite people telling me (in confidence – and it’s staying that way) about some of the ways in which money has been wasted, and opportunities to get money have been ignored. But I’ve reached the stage where I think it’s pointless to carry-on simply saying “aww ’tis a shame but they’ve done a great job”…

Sorry, but I think that regardless of the fact that the aircraft did finally fly, it’s time that people started asking why so much money has been spent on people who aren’t even the engineers who did the actual work. As I’ve said, I don’t care how it’s wrapped-up, a salary of 60k or anything even remotely near that figure is just ridiculous for someone who at best, has merely overseen a project and negotiated with the companies concerned. If people seriously think that undertaking this kind of task is worth anything like that amount of money, then I’m gobsmacked. This was supposed to be a project to raise as much money as possible for the aircraft, not to put into someone’s pocket.

It wouldn’t be so bad if Pleming had actually achieved a whole lot for his money but I’m not seeing any evidence of that. Okay, he seems to have persuaded some of the major players (Marshall BAe etc.) to waive costs and so on but let’s be honest – the bulk of the project’s money came from the HLF and it certainly didn’t need 60k to pay someone to negotiate with HLF. I don’t buy the notion that he’s some sort of wizard who can charm money out of people’s pockets (although on a personal level he doesn’t seem to have done so bad!), especially when there are so many experienced and influential former Vulcan people around who would surely have commanded just as much (or rather more) respect.

I’m cynical by nature but I’ve always given TVOC the benefit of the doubt as despite everything, they did get the aircraft back into the air. But now, when you look at the way that the money has been handled, the complete lack of any obvious future finance (despite Pleming’s promises that there would be lots of it) and no obvious plan to prevent the aircraft from rotting at Bruntingthorpe, I don’t think anyone could claim that Pleming’s efforts have been particularly impressive. It’s fine to say that such matters shouldn’t be discussed in a public forum but let’s be stright about this – it’s the public’s money that Pleming is banking and I think it only right that every penny should be accounted for. If there’s nothing to hide, why hide? Likewise, if I’m being accused of making unsubstantiated claims and simply indulging in gossip, TVOC can put a stop to this immediately, as they could have done all along. The project is paid for by us therefore it seems only right and proper that TVOC should tell us everything that goes-on. But of course they never do, therefore they can hardly complain when people start to conclude that they’re not handling things as well as they could.

With the best will in the world it’s hard to imagine why anyone would abandon a very well-paid job to take-on a task like the Vulcan’s restoration, and claim to be doing it purely because of a passion for the aircraft’s future. If that’s the case, taking 60k for one’s efforts just doesn’t make sense. The whole thing smacks of a poorly-managed project which has struggled to survive, with some people taking a hideous amount of money out of it for no reason other than to profit from the dontations from well-meaning enthusiasts. You telling me that the folks who have struggled to scrape a few pounds together to send over to TVOC will be delighted to know that 60k has gone into one man’s pocket – and not even for doing anything more than management and negotiation?

Nope, it stinks, and I’m not the only person who thinks that. On a wider note, I’m also surprised and saddened that the aviation press – the very people who are in the position to raise such matters – have done nothing. They publish TVOC’s press releases, add a bit of PR hype and that’s it. Don’t the magazines have any integrity? Are they only there to churn-out pretty pictures and meaningless hype? Surely, they are the very people who should be examining the project thoroughly and demaning some honest answers? Or maybe that’s me being unrealistic again?!

Hmm, good argument… sounds remarkably similar to mine though? You guys obviously think that 60k (or anything even approaching that figure) is justified so as I said previously, I’d be fascinated to hear precisely what we get for 60k. I mean, I’m just a mere mortal, what do I know about these things… do tell…:rolleyes: