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  • in reply to: Soviet Airforces combat tactics in the 80s #2406691
    over G
    Participant

    The A was not cleared for 9gs operations, the C was, of course at altitude, both planes performance was close, and probably the A was better.

    A clean configuration vs a loaded one with weapons is still not a fair comparison, no matter how annoying for some people the kiwwi guy is.

    in reply to: Soviet Airforces combat tactics in the 80s #2406720
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    Participant

    Because the F-15A was the first fighter able to pull sustained 9gs, right? 😀

    Is funny because id a test claiming F-15/A-B, while there are not weights given and no more detailed data over it.

    1985 test, most likely a F-15C

    in reply to: The Supersonic Canberra #2408994
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    Participant

    Maybe someone mixed data about that

    16

    You are the only mixed up here , probably with your Schorschy companion.. 😀

    http://i49.tinypic.com/30mn6u9.jpg

    Your ’empty equipped’ is empty…but with fuel (4.6 tons)….

    This is not ‘sapparently only a bit more fuel?’ as Schoreg said, the 21 carried just 2 tm of internal fuel (2600lt x 0.8).

    http://www.airwar.ru/enc/bomber/yak28i.html

    http://www.fas.org/nuke/guide/russia/airdef/ru_monino_aircraft_yak28_specs_01.jpg

    So much for the ‘dramatic technology gap in the early Cold War days.’ 🙂

    BTW, the only Thunderchief that had +1000 km of radius was the D-model, all the others had radius ranging from 500 to 700km

    in reply to: The Supersonic Canberra #2409109
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    Participant

    I mean, if a full internal load flexed the fuselage that much that the canopy jammed open if it wasn’t closed before loading, then surely something must be wrong with the design?

    lol, that was a harsh age for the aviation 😀

    Probably had to do with the bomb bay and how was it designed, wonder if somebody has a structural schematic of it.

    It was simply an obsolete airframe.

    I don’t really think in that way, depends on is what is defined as ‘obsolete’, is the B-52 obsolete?, is old is a really old design, but still working, same for the Tu-95.

    Yes the yak is not in service anymore, but that airframe was so heavily used in so many task, and performance ranges, that i hardly would classify it as ‘obsolete’, at least in the 60’s, it had not bad performances either, it was probably the best configuration for the 60’s technology, all the other planes finished heavier, the f-105, the f-101, all them with 4-3 tons more.

    But is was ugly, yes that’s for sure 🙂

    but I can assure you that it’s a very cramped cockpit. The view forward through that cool windshield isn’t all that great either.

    Would like to see them, wonder if the pilot had the ‘windshield guy’ lol, on sight.

    Wonder if was actually a co-pilot there..i mean a seat or something like that?

    in reply to: Soviet Airforces combat tactics in the 80s #2409119
    over G
    Participant

    The human-machine interface of the Russian designs were aimed at GCI-supported interception of aircraft.

    And sure this is bad right?

    As soon as they operated outside their mutual support area, these designs performed miserably.

    Oh here comes another nosense babbling…

    In a many versus many situation, the lack of training and the bad equipment of the WP air forces would result in heavy losses.

    poor stupid soviets, western pilots were awesome cowboys the kings of the sky…

    The WP-aircraft were not bad, but tailored to a specific mission. A good pilot in a MiG-23ML could do a difference, just they were so few of them.

    Ohh here here! 😀

    in reply to: The Supersonic Canberra #2409162
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    Participant

    More pictures, for the trolls 😀

    http://cdn-www.airliners.net/aviation-photos/photos/9/6/2/1117269.jpg

    http://img89.imageshack.us/img89/1841/yak28u1.jpg

    http://cdn-www.airliners.net/aviation-photos/photos/4/9/2/1677294.jpg

    great plane

    in reply to: The Supersonic Canberra #2409181
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    Participant

    How so, a 10 tons aircraft with decent performance, M1.8 speed

    The Yak-28 couldn’t …
    … do any worthwhile conventional mission
    … do any fighter work (the F-105 was at least a bit able)

    How do you really know this?

    You are just babbling things w/o any backing

    o, but muuuuuuch better.

    The F4 was a 14 tons aircraft, and it performance was not that great either

    ***

    Is not ‘max range’ it was combat radius , max range was 3000km, f-105 combat radius was 1200 km as well

    You have noticed the fact that a MiG-21 pulled a miserable range out of its 3t internal fuel at 6t OEW and ONE engine, while the Yak had two and apparently only a bit more fuel?

    I don’t understand what do you try to compare with two totally different configurations, is claimed 1190km combat radius and ‘flight range’ of about 3 hours.

    in reply to: Soviet Airforces combat tactics in the 80s #2409229
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    Participant

    The dumb evil soviet robots…good one

    in reply to: The Supersonic Canberra #2409241
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    Participant

    Thank you ‘flankerman’

    Do you know the specific reasons for the problems with this airplane?, probably was difficult to recover after stalling or at some specific maneuvers?, I’m thinking about it, because it small tail controls, and the interaction of the wing shape, area and lift center with this wing, i’m just guessing the mass center location, but probably the MC and LC were too close?, in other worlds, after stalling would be not controllable..’in other words’ is always the best explanation…..:D

    Still a great plane

    Impressive this basic airframe layout was used in so many tasks and so many performance ranges.

    in reply to: The Supersonic Canberra #2409443
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    Participant

    Thank you!

    Air breaks?

    http://www.historicflight.cz/month_event/Jak_28R/Jak_28%20(17).jpg

    Another interesting thing is the Su-25’s long engine pods, much like the Yak-28’s ones, there is a special flow requirement for this engine’s family? or is just a coincidence?, i can understand the yak needed it for the high Mach requirement and the movable inlet, for the su-25 there is probably other reason..

    in reply to: The Supersonic Canberra #2409505
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    Participant

    two engines Me262 style

    Haha, lovely plane, IMO the yak-28 was one of the most intelligent designs/layouts out there, if i put it into a scale comparing with other more popular/modern aircraft some people would cry about it …

    A very underrated design.

    Wonder if the landing gear actually brings some weight reductions compared with the conventional twin gear

    in reply to: The Supersonic Canberra #2409534
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    Participant

    It was not a success.

    This happens when you try to convert a multirole airframe into a specialized airframe

    What is interesting is that the designers went from that engine configuration to the classical yak configuration in the yak-45.

    http://www.testpilot.ru/review/crafts/img/yak45.jpg

    This is really interesting, why did Yak left the side by side engine configuration for the su-15 contest? why did they return with the typical wing mounted engine for the yak-45?

    f-105

    mach 2 with 13 tons weight, 1200km radius

    vs

    mach 1.8 with 10 tons weight, 1200km radius

    big deal, i had rather go with the lighter airframe.

    14-13 tons was the weight equipped (with fuel)

    Surely the supersonic Canberra was the Tornado?

    Too heavy, too complicated, too fancy for that title 🙂

    ******

    One fun thing i can see on this plane is the variety of the nose windows design

    in reply to: The Supersonic Canberra #2409592
    over G
    Participant

    Probably because it was the worst supersonic aircraft ever conceived.

    It was essentially a conventional aircraft with enough installed thrust to jump over the sound barrier. The slow top speed and high weight speak for itself. The fact that the USSR didn’t have anything better till mid/end 1960ies shows the dramatic technology gap in the early Cold War days.

    Your idea to do the job of the MiG-27 or Suchoi 17 with a Firebar shows your lack of thorough thinking: both aircraft were required to operate from short fields, and the Yak-28 was probably the runway-hungriest aircraft of its era.

    Because all the planes must be fancy and looking good? :rolleyes:, it was a bomber, it had specific requirements, then it became into a fighter.

    In the other side of the world things were not much better

    As bomber it was very good, compared with other planes of it age, like the f-101, and it was even lighter.

    Yes i agree the take of running was not great, but the mig-27 did not improve this dramatically, from 1200m to 900m, with a VG wing and all the added weight, better to improve the Yak design.

    What ‘high weight’? (10 tons), what ‘low peak speed’?? (mach 1.8)

    Do you realize that were Yaks fitted with AB, and w/o AB?

    Who has lack of ‘ thorough thinking’? 🙂

    in reply to: The Supersonic Canberra #2409638
    over G
    Participant

    The max speed of the yak-28s fitted with afterburners was M1.8, quite good, was clear the design was optimized for both, transonic and supersonic speed, the engine pods under the wings was another interesting idea, mostly used for civilian planes for easy access on the engine for better maintenance, this is a interesting requirement for a CAS aircraft, while the yak-28 was most likely less tougher than the Su-25, probably a further design based on it had performed better, both engines are very separated, this could be an advantage, since the probability that both would be hit at once had to be low, remains to be seen how simpler and reliable the controls were.

    More/less the same configuration was used for the Yak-45, a plane that was in competition with the Mig-29, even the same landing gear configuration, is interesting how Yak was so confident in this design.

    The bloke in the nose became superfluous with improved avionics.

    I disagree, a special crew trained for CAS would be welcome to recognize and classify targets, CAS is a nasty job, and many times high tech gizmos are useless compared with a guy with night vision goggles.

    The Su-24 took over the longer-range strike role.

    The fencer is other class of aircraft

    More online pictures, waiting for some pictures from the inside.

    http://www.airwar.ru/image/idop/spy/yak28r/yak28r-8.jpg

    http://static12.images.tpzj.com/images/mil/2009/2009519/11/11800/s600/11800_1.jpg

    Damn sexy plane, the tail controls were very small, it seems.

    in reply to: PAK-FA Saga Episode 14 #2411306
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    Participant

    Like the nex gen engines which will be ready in 10-12 years? Like the radar which is still being developed?

    Most likely russians are not desperate to get the next gen engine, and probably the next gen engine will be based on new technologies (like variable bypassing), they will put into service before the new engine will come, i think they are sure they will meet the requirements with this 15 (?) ton engine.

    The old Su-27 imposed a speed record in a closed circuit with payload, was not bad really i think it was 1500km with a average speed of Mach 1.5 with the al31 engines, probably a derivative of this engine + new aerodynamics would be enough for the requirements…actually, most likely.

    at the aircraft’s nose clearly indicate that there is no radar fitted.

    Then the russians painted the typical radiation sign for crew warning just for trolling, all the measuring equipment can be removed.

    After that video of the T50 and the russian president, i think there are things that have not been told.

Viewing 15 posts - 301 through 315 (of 1,640 total)