ChackoIMHO if Kanwa article is speculation, the whole J-10 articles are speculation. I remember Chinese members upbeat on Kanwa’s reporting on J-10. Now let me post a China.com article.It too sites Kanwa article. I had read about the Russian involvement in J-10 structural changes , placing the Al-31 Gearbox on the bottom and try to reduce enginesize and increase thrust (strage isn’t it? WS-10 claims the same changes). Let me dig it up.
[B]Note: If you say that the Kanwa report is in accurate then the Kanwa claim that PLAAF is happy with it and is being accepted is also wrong. Also then China is not producing these aircrafts forget 50 aircrafts being produced. Why is there a selective approval of Kanwa article? :confused: /B]
This is the chinese site china.com
J10A即將擴大量產 走向正軌之後達每年50架
2004-04-27 09:15:39
俄羅斯APMC－TACC通訊社24日引述加拿大漢和情報評論5月號的報道聲稱俄羅斯中國在今年一月簽訂了空軍裝備供應協定。協定將提供中國新一批AL31系列發動機和SU30MKK使用的導彈、武器系統。報道聲稱俄羅斯稍後將會向中國提供Kh31A空對艦導彈。
漢和情報評論代總編輯平可夫表示俄向中國交運的空中打擊武器數量遠遠超過正常狀況下的搭配標準。
俄羅斯APMC－TACC通訊社24日在另一篇報道中引述漢和情報評論的消息聲稱J10A的年產量將在今年走向正軌之後達到50架的標準。報道聲稱因為有了12年使用Su27SK的經驗，漢和情報預測中國空軍在接收J10A的過程中將會更加順利。報道聲稱J10A同時也面臨設計上的若干問題。由於換裝AL31FN發動機，加大了尺寸和重量，因此造成了進氣口強度不足的問題。因此需要以加強筋方式與機身連接，目前重新設計的工作已經展開。AL31FN已經縮小了尺寸並且把變速器下置。尺寸的變化包括由AL31F的4.99米縮短到4.897米，最大外部直徑由AL31F的1.28米縮小到1.140米。重量由AL31F的1570公斤降低到1547公斤。AL31FN使用全動式噴嘴。儘管進行了上述尺寸縮小改良，但是發動機的功率並沒有降低。AL31FN提供12500kgf推力，燃油在最佳經濟動力狀態下的消耗量達到0.685kgf*h。發動機採用了模組化設計。然而即使經過類似改良，AL31FN在結構上還是比WS10笨重，造成了J10A進氣道強度不夠的困擾。
另據透露漢和情報評論由中國進口Il76的數量推算出中國產“新預警”的生產規模。國際航空分析人士普遍高度評價了中國生產的“新預警”和J10A。平可夫聲稱“新預警”2003年10月之後就在YANLIAN試飛院進行試飛，南京14所只是負責雷達設計而已。西安已經開始了新一批“新預警”的生產。在俄羅斯，預警機的試飛工作由Irkutsk飛機公司下屬的Taganzog企業負責，他們沒有全部介入中國“新預警”的試飛工作。雷達設計與俄羅斯、以色列沒有關係。平可夫表示中國“新預警”和A50雷達的結構、尺寸完全不同，更為超前。
他以個人的人生經驗聲稱就事論事，做人、做為國家需要這樣的勇氣與志氣。值得日本和台灣學習。“2002年夏，中國與俄羅斯有關進口或者租借預警機的談判完全中斷，負責這一項目的消息來源聲稱就是有預警機進口，中國也不要了。因為‘中央’下了死命令，把自己研製預警機的工作當作政治任務，一定要搞出自己的預警機”。平可夫表示。當然，14所早在90年代就開始研製預警雷達，“新預警”只是使舊計劃復活、升級而已。漢和情報評論在2003年11月30日網路版披露了中國正在試飛預警機的消息。
圖片選自本站論壇
Bablefish translation
After J10A soon expands massively produces moves towards 正軌 reaches every year 50
2004-04-27 09:15:39
Russian APMC – the TACC news agency on 24th quotes the Canadian Chinese and information commentary in May the number report declared the Russian China signed the air force in this January to equip the supply agreement. The agreement will provide China the new batch of AL31 series engine and the SU30MKK use missile, the armament system. The report declared Russia shortly after will be able to provide the Kh31A air-to-ship missile to China. The Chinese and information commentary generation of editor-in-chief is even may the husband express Russia the airborne strike weapon quantity which is in luck to China goes far beyond under the normal condition to match the standard. Russian APMC – the TACC news agency on 24th quotes the Chinese and the information commentary news in another report declared J10A the annual output will move towards after this year 正軌 achieves 50 standards. The report declared because had 12 years to use Su27SK the experience, the Chinese and the information forecast the Chinese air force in will receive J10A in the process to be able to be smoother. The report declared at the same time J10A also faces in the design certain questions. Because replaces the AL31FN engine, has enlarged the size and the weight, therefore has created the problem which the air inlet intensity is insufficient. Therefore needed by the stiffener way and the fuselage connection, at present the redesign work already launches. AL31FN already reduced the size and to set the transmission gearbox under. The size change including reduces from the AL31F 4.99 meters to 4.897 meters, the biggest outside diameter reduces from the AL31F 1.28 meters to 1.140 meters. The weight reduces from the AL31F 1,570 kilograms to 1,547 kilograms. The AL31FN use all moves the type spray nozzle. Although has carried on above minification improvement, but the engine power has not certainly reduced. AL31FN provides the 12500kgf thrust force, the fuel oil achieves 0.685kgf*h under best economic force condition consumption. The engine has used 模組 the design. However even if passes through the similar improvement, AL31FN or was unwieldyr than in the structure WS10, has created the J10A air intake intensity not 夠 puzzle. As further explained the Chinese and the information commentary imports Il76 the quantity calculates center the domestic product “the new early warning” the production scale by China. The international air analyst generally highly appraised China to produce “the new early warning” and J10A. Even may the husband after declare “new early warning” in October, 2003 on carries on the test flight in the YANLIAN test flight courtyard, Nanjing 14 only is responsible for the radar design. Xi’an already started the new one batch “the new early warning” production. In Russia, the early-warning aircraft test flight work enterprise is responsible by Irkutsk the airplane company subordinate’s Taganzog, they do not have completely involves China “the new early warning” the test flight work. The radar design and Russia, Israel have not related. Even may the husband express China “the new early warning” and the A50 radar structure, the size are completely different, in advance. He declares by individual life experience considers the matter in and of itself, is the person, does for the country needs such courage and the spirit. Is worth Japan and Taiwan studies. “In 2002 the summer, Chinese and the Russian related import or rents the early-warning aircraft the negotiations completely to sever, is responsible for this project the news origin to declare has the early-warning aircraft to import, China does not want. Because ‘ central ‘ has gotten down the doom command, develops oneself the early-warning aircraft the work to treat as the political task, certainly must do own early-warning aircraft “. Even may the husband express. Certainly, 14 as early as start in the 90’s to develop the early warning radar, “the new early warning” only is causes old plan reactivating, the promotion. The Chinese and the information commentary the network version has disclosed the Chinese test flight early-warning aircraft news in November 30, 2003.
ChackoWanwei Reader’s Net: April 28, 2004
Canada’s Kanwa says China to buy engines from Russia for the J-10
(Wanwei Reader’s Net) According to Canada’s Kanwa Intelligence Review, Russia and China this year signed an agreement for the supply of airforce equipment. Russia is to supply China with new AL-31 series engines as well as missiles and weapons systems used by the Su-30MKK. Later Russia will supply China with the Kh31 air-to-sea missile.
According to Xianggang Shangbao, Kanwa said that production of the PLA J-10 will reach a standard production ouptut of 50 planes per year after entering regular production this year. However, due to design problems, installation in the J-10 of the AL31F engine led to an increase in size and weight, resulting in an insufficiency in the strength of the air-intake. Because of this, the joints between the engine and the fuselage needed to be strengthened. Work on this redesign has already started, and the dimensions of the AL31FN has been reduced and the transmission removed.
The J-10A has been developed by Factory 132 in Chengdu, and is considered to have capabilties comparable to those of the F-16 fighters Taiwan purchased from the United States. It has been said that recently when North Korean leader Kim Jong-il was visiting China, he expressed that he wanted to purchase the J-10 but was tactfully refused by China.
What do they mean by transmission removed? And taiwan has Block 20 F-16 , so J-10 comes close to Block 20?
ChackoHey Brute Gorilla, you posted this thing on PakDef too. I think the general response was something about why would China start mass producing an airplane if it had severe problems in it? And China has pumped alot of moolah into Chengdu and wants a quality aircraft in return. In general, I agree with them but there still might be a few bugs in the J-10A but only small ones which can be worked out later.
Well i don’t agree with them or you. All i am asking is if someone has full article?
ChackoWhere is it? Is full article posted?
ChackoOld Perrys are off the shelf. Excelent companions for aircraft carriers till Indian options come through. It seems IN had perry on wish list for long time.
ChackoAtleast US is willing to part with Perry class and Orions to India.
ChackoBG, you are missing the point- you may be correct that a MKI’ed Su35 may be superior to a std Mirage 2000-5, but:
1. Relying on the Su again will give Russia/ SU undue leverage over the IAF
2.Developing a new a/c plus integrating new avionics may again create a hassle and a delay- thus rendering the quick acquisition a flop.2 is why the IAF actually explicitly notes that they are negotiating for the 2000- V, off the shelf, already developed and available.
Yes.
Chacko😀 Has the Indian Navy ever considered purchasing something along the lines of CV-64, USS Constellation? All it would take would be a refit, adding electronics to meet Indian Navy standards, and training for their personnel to operate the steam plant on board the “Connie”. As for aircraft, possibly Mig-29Ks, E-2C Hawkeye, and possibly EA-6B. Not a bad idea, really. At least it is in better shape than the Admiral Gorshkov. 😀
And are on par with the assets in our neighbourhoods. It makes sence. IN can use its modern assets somewhere else. These junks from ex-USN fleet is enough for most modern offerings from neighbourhood. besides we don’t need to spend money to counter such navies.
ChackoDextrose
Thanks.
Another point i don’t understand is M2K-5 was considered as LRCA and lost to SU-30k. Now M2K-5 is considered for MRCA. Now whats M2K-5? LRCA or MRCA?
ChackoAFIK Evaluation was M2K-5 vs SU-30 MK.
ChackoBG, we treated………..Thats redundancy- if we rely only on Sukhois- we
lose the redundancy
give Sukhoi/ Russia too much bargaining powerThat is why we have always balanced our acquisitions between East and West
Cheers.
Nitin thats good point. But when IAF was evaluating M2K-5 and Sukhois initially, IAF gve thumbs up to superiority of Sukhois over M2K-5’s. Thats how SU-30 MKI’s were purchased. So why not a MCRA specific SU?
ChackoAFIK thats what i said first that a MMCRA MKI has to be made. read my previous posts.
Now try putting the substandard parts from CIS on Mirages you will have mig-21 effect. IMHO, MiG’s were given stepmotherly treatment. Treat mirages like Mig’s and you will know the difference.
ChackoAll i said is a new version of MKI MMCRA specs will do. Its dependable as a lot of parts are already tested. Now if we go for M2K-9 or MiG-29 SMT M1 or M2, its the same result.
As far as Mirages being dependable and hasn’t crashed is because of baby sitting it. Russian fighter have been flown so much without that baby sitting ad are still dependable.
ChackoYou conviniently for got Baseline Su-30 MK range which i posted
Su-30
12 external stations for more than 8,000 kg (17,635 lb) of stores
internal fuel combat range- 1,620 n miles (3,000 km; 1,865 miles)
with one in-flight refueling combat range- 2,805 n miles (5,200 km; 3,230 miles)
Throw in couple of drop tanks. Su’s can go lo-lo-lo, drop the baby, climb high and fight its way back. Mirages will be barely able to drop it and come back.
Chackook, you are trying to beat mme with my own post in PR. But range still sucks.
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